Jump to content
308AR.com Community
  • Visit Aero Precision
  • Visit Brownells
  • Visit EuroOptic
  • Visit Site
  • Visit Beachin Tactical
  • Visit Rainier Arms
  • Visit Ballistic Advantage
  • Visit Palmetto State Armory
  • Visit Cabelas
  • Visit Sportsmans Guide

PSA PA10 GenII lower with PA-65 , 6.5CM 20" rifle length gas upper review.... PSA Nailed it !!


bfoosh006

Recommended Posts

  • Replies 54
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

  • 4 weeks later...

Finally got to the range today for the Trued n' Glued testing.... If anyone isn't sure if it helps, I can say, either my shooting skills dramatically improved... or the Trued n' Glued worked.

I will do the Tn'G on all my AR platforms.... the results are so obvious, that most groups could be readily / easily be seen to be better.... without measuring at the range.

  Improvements in the realm of 1MOA+ will be seen in the following downloaded photos.

I will note the measured improvements as well as the few "didn't change a thing" ones.

I am hoping to alter the original posts with a before ( OEM ) and after, True n' Glue photo.

Give me some time... but, again.. if you aren't sure if you want to do it.... I will argue that you should !! Lol

Also there will be some added ammo tested from the Tn'G barrel.

 

Wow .... I am still impressed with the results just thinking about it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

From this point on ( until the OCD in me wants a higher quality barrel ) .. all accuracy results will be from the OEM PSA barrel, installed in the PSA  with a Trued Reciever face and "glued" in place with Loctite 609.

 

I am going to post the results from the Tn'G receiver and barrel... some got better some got worse.

I would recommend doing this though, I feel like it shoots more variety of ammo better then before.

It took all of about 15 minutes to do... and most all of that time was RnR'ing the barrel, gas block, and FF tube.

 

I whole heartly recommend doing this to all your AR platforms.

 

I will try to post the different groups in the same order as the original thread...just to keep it simple ( including and repeats ... arrgh  )

 

Remember, some pretty dramatic results came from doing this ( unless my bench skills magically improved dramatically... Lol )

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Nosler 140gr HPBT... Tn'G...Difference in size.. Before... .7890" 5rds.... After ... 1.1890" 5rds

Federal AE 140gr.....Tn'G....Difference in size, ....Before... .9425" 5rds.... After ... .9810" 5rds

Hornady 120gr ELD...Tn'G....Difference in size,....Before... 1.0130" 5rds.... After ... 1.9190" 5rds ... pulled another one..

SIG 140gr OTM ...Tn'G.... Difference in size .........Before... 1.1830" 5rds.... After ... .9580" 5rds

IMG_2740.JPG

IMG_2728.JPG

IMG_2741.JPG

IMG_2738.JPG

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Creedmoor Sports 142gr SMK HPBT

Difference in group size Creedmoor 142gr SMK... Before.... 1.1080" 5rds... After... 1.2670" 6rds... ( because I flubbed one and wanted to see if it was me or the ammo )

 

Federal "Non-Typical" 140gr SP.... ( I was hoping these would do better ....Flat base and all )

Difference in group size, Federal "Non-Typical" 140gr SP.... 1.9315", Before.... 2.7030 After........ also a funky group...fire one it goes in the same hole as another, next goes way off... next same hole... then way off..

 

Hornady American Gunner 140gr BTHP ... NOTE 2 separate groups with two separate POA

Difference in group size, Hornady American Gunner 140gr BTHP.... 1.1950" before.... .7520", after........ HUGE difference

 

Browning 129gr BRX

Difference in group size, Browning 129gr BRX.... 1.8335" before.... 2.6610", after.... my barrel just doesn't like this ammo.

IMG_2747.JPG

IMG_2745.JPG

IMG_2734.JPG

IMG_2744.JPG

Edited by bfoosh006
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Hornady American Whitetail 129gr Interlock

Difference in group size, Hornady American Whitetail 129gr Interlock... .... 3.0965" before.... 2.2410", after

 

Hornady 120gr A-Max

Difference in group size., Hornady 120gr A-Max... 1.8260" Before.... 1.4175", After....

 

FGMM 130gr Hybrid OTM...Huge difference....

Difference in group size, FGMM 130gr Hybrid OTM..... Before 2.3660" 5rds, .... After .9580"..... OH YEAH !

.

Hornady 140gr ELD Match... Huge difference....

Difference in group size, .Hornady 140gr ELD Match.... Before 2.2045" 5rds, .... After .9290"..... OH YEAH !

IMG_2742.JPG

IMG_2739.JPG

IMG_2729.JPG

IMG_2746.JPG

Edited by bfoosh006
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Norma Match 130gr HPBT..... very similar groups, box markings, case and bullet as the PRIME ammo

Difference in group size, Norma Match 130gr HPBT.... Before 2.4425" 5rds, .... After 1.9660".....

 

PRIME 130gr HPBT Match....Huge difference....


Difference in group size, PRIME 130gr HPBT Match.... Before 1.9165" 5rds, .... After .9620"..... icon_smile_big.gif

 

Hornady Superformance 129gr SST

Difference in group size.....Hornady Superformance 129gr SST... Before 2.1265... After... 2.6635

 

Creedmoor Sports 140gr Nosler BTHP....Huge difference....


Difference in group size...Creedmoor Sports 140gr Nosler BTHP... Before 1.5135"... After... .8770"

 

IMG_2731.JPG

IMG_2732.JPG

IMG_2749.JPG

IMG_2748.JPG

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Some new, previously untested ammo groups....

Nosler Ballistic Tips 140gr... Overall 1.7625, 7 rds, The Nosler ballistic tip ammo was consistently producing two distinct groups....one shot low, one shot high.. smiley_freak.gif... or I was !!
4rd group... 1.1030, 3rd group... .8900"

 

Winchester 125gr XP .... 1.3645" 5rds.

 


Creedmoor Sports 140gr Hornady bullet.... .9570"  

 

Photos in the order listed

IMG_2737.JPG

IMG_2733.JPG

IMG_2748.JPG

Edited by bfoosh006
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 4 weeks later...

Soooo.... I bought another complete PA10 lower.... is has a longer carbine buffer tube, a regular AR15 length buffer, and a longer buffer spring then my first PA10 lower. I haven't measured them yet... but is sure looks like a Armalite .308 length buffer system.

So... prior to any purchasing of buffer parts, I strongly suggest you post photos of what actually came with your rifle.

The "new" longer length buffer tube is marked "PA10" with the PSA "Logo" as well ... the buffer is AR15 length ( no markings ) as hand compared to a spare AR15 carbine buffer I have laying around.

Here are some side by side photos for comparison...the "New" sized buffer system is on the left.

The older "DPMS" style buffer systems is on the right.

 

 

I am now wondering how many times the different ones have been used... and how many times it may have caused mayhem and confusion.

IMG_2796.JPG

IMG_2797.JPG

Link to comment
Share on other sites

19 hours ago, bfoosh006 said:

Soooo.... I bought another complete PA10 lower.... is has a longer carbine buffer tube, a regular AR15 length buffer, and a longer buffer spring then my first PA10 lower. I haven't measured them yet... but is sure looks like a Armalite .308 length buffer system.

So... prior to any purchasing of buffer parts, I strongly suggest you post photos of what actually came with your rifle.

The "new" longer length buffer tube is marked "PA10" with the PSA "Logo" as well ... the buffer is AR15 length ( no markings ) as hand compared to a spare AR15 carbine buffer I have laying around.

Here are some side by side photos for comparison...the "New" sized buffer system is on the left.

The older "DPMS" style buffer systems is on the right.

 

 

I am now wondering how many times the different ones have been used... and how many times it may have caused mayhem and confusion.

IMG_2796.JPG

IMG_2797.JPG

 Could you measure the Springs & count the coils , also weigh the Buffers & also measure them ( length )  , if I'm not asking too much .:laffs:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Glad to...

 

Here are the measured weights and lengths between the "New" and "Older" versions.

Again, remember these parts do not interchange... unless you the complete buffer system ( DPMS v. Armalite )

New / Armalite / Longer.......................... Older / DPMS / Shorter

Supplied OEM PSA buffer ............ ( Both are way to light IMHO, they should be min. 5.4oz )

.....3.8oz / OAL 3.260"...................................3.8oz / OAL 2.5"

Supplied OEM PSA Buffer Tube......

.....5.0oz / OAL 7 7/8" ..................................5.0oz / OAL 7 1/4"

Supplied OEM PSA Buffer Spring.....

......1.5oz / OAL 11 3/8" / 29coils..................1.5oz / OAL 10 5/8" / 28coils

Difference between the two, in the fully compressed spring / buffer / BCG bottomed out in the buffer tubes using the supplied parts.... the "New" Buffer system is 3/32 longer and will not compress as short as the old one.... so if you are having Bolt catch issues... this is possibly why.

The depth of the "New" buffer tube is 7 11/16"

Again the "New" buffer system length is a better choice IMHO , allowing for more common parts and a heavier buffer weight....

However.... changing mid-stream is bound to confuse the subject.

Edited by bfoosh006
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 2 months later...
3 hours ago, GoodByNAair said:

Great reporting on the 6.5 Creed. Looks like PSA put a little more work into that barrel.  If you have time you should make a DIY of your "Trued n' Glued" procedure.

True the receiver face with a lapping tool, and install the barrel with loc-tite 609.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 3 weeks later...

BTW, ...I've got another PSA 6.5CM upper on the way to test.... so results should be better then my previous small sample size.

And, rumor has it, that a cutting tool could be altered to do the receiver truing and upper BCG channel cutting at the same time.... allowing for a very straight axis between the two.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

28 minutes ago, bfoosh006 said:


And, rumor has it, that a cutting tool could be altered to do the receiver truing and upper BCG channel cutting at the same time.... allowing for a very straight axis between the two.

That is "true" - pun intended!  I don't know why more manufacturers don't do this already.  Well, more "manufacturers" are relying on outside sources to "finish" the raw forgings, is why. Very few "manufacturers" machine their uppers and lowers. PSA can get a leg up on this - and PSA can actually offer "trued" upper receivers for the DPMS-based lowers out there - if PSA is sticking to the DPMS-based platform.  Hint, hint...  stick to a dedicated, widely-used platform, pimp your machining of the upper receiver tolerances, and offer that upper receiver as a "match" receiver... hint, hint...

I have two AR15 upper receivers that I bought, just because of this - same manufacturer. Billet machined upper receivers that have a receiver face with a "parallelism" of 0.0003" true to the bore axis.  That's 3/ten thou...  "Parallelism" was their word, not mine, but it's a real word...  :laffs: Both those AR15s are REAL shooters, too - holy shiit, do they shoot the lights out! The "Billet UltraMatch" upper receivers aren't a joke - they work.  Not naming names, but...   :thumbup:

 

Edited by 98Z5V
Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, 98Z5V said:

Billet machined upper receivers that have a receiver face with a "parallelism" of 0.0003" true to the bore axis.  That's 3/ten thou...  "Parallelism" was their word, not mine, but it's a real word...  :laffs:

That's probably the natural result of trying to dumb down the explanation so people can understand. Throw "perpendicularity" (or more correctly "orthagonal") into the explanation and the average person's eyes just glaze over.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
×
  • Create New...