Owl21

What? Who gave me advice on what? I was not seeking advice, nor did I note anyone giving advice to me; though my advice to the OP was disputed by someone else.

Looks like you got it fixed

WTF? They make vice blocks specifically for putting your upper (or lower for that matter) receiver into a vice. AR manufacturer's use them hundreds of times per day.

Oh yeah? Why is that? Would a rifle take more or less abuse in actual combat? You know, clanging in and out of vehicles, being pounded on the ground while sprinting to new positions, etc., etc. Regardless of whether this rifle is a safe queen, bench rest paper shooter, or something less than its intended purpose, it is still a battle rifle. And a battle rifle should be able to withstand abuse. My suggestion is not in any way abusive (if properly performed) and is based on experience with his particular handguard and the fact that installing it per the manufacturer's directions may not be sufficient, and testing by hand can be inconclusive. And simply saying "I installed it per the manufacturer's directions" does not actually indicate that it is working as intended; you know, kind of like installing a barrel nut to 30 ft lbs, per the manufacturer's instructions, not necessarily being enough in some circumstances.

I agree with all of the above. Barrel nut first. I had one that I had to get extra tight in order to get the accuracy that was expected. Also check that your muzzle device is secure. Also check the muzzle for any nicks at the exit. I am familiar with the handguard that you have. I had one that I could never get tight enough. By hand, it may feel tight, but under the recoil it can move slightly, which is enough to throw off your shots. Clamp it in the vice (protect the finish) and wiggle your stock latterally to check tightness. Of course, throw some 168 or 175 match ammo through it as previously mentioned. However even will ball ammo, you should be getting significantly less than 4 MOA.

Maybe I am too old, but what are gamer tags? I have seen it mentioned a few times now. Nevermind. I seached it.

I have not done that one yet, but it does look fun.

EXACTLY!! That is of course if you consider running 200 yards, then rappeling down a 60' cliff, with each shooter locating a small target (usally a pair of eggs, pingpong balls, or some other small objects a couple hundred yards away) and setting up to shoot, with the requirement that both shooters must break their shots within two seconds of each other, then engaging two distant KD targets (usually one past 600 and one past 400, but still breaking the shots within two seconds of each other), then hopping into a gator and engaging 2/3 IPSC targets at close range on both sides while moving (this is where they call one of the rifles down, and because you are not allowed to sweep your muzzle across the gator, the shooters pass one rifle back and forth, and invariably they choose the gun running the 10X fixed power scope to keep in the game), then you are finally dropped off at a building that you must enter (it may be locked/baricaded, etc., and there may or may not be targets inside) and set-up inside to engage targets outside at varying distances to complete the course. This is all done while wearing tier one and two gear, and that is just the first morning's course. Sometimes we get the chance to play the shooting version of Horse, but in a two man team style. This is the game where you watch the women smoke the men in overall shooting ability. So yes, it is role playing: fun as hell roleplaying that has the tendency to increase your skills.

You are mixing up the different things I deal with. Some things are competitions (lots of different calibers around), some things are tactical training (only a few calibers around), and some things are private groups doing off the wall training where everyone is trying to adapt to the mystical whims of the evil planners and their crazy scenarios. It ain't all one thing.

I wasn't gonna say it...

2.25" group at 91 meters! You suck! (not because of the 2.25" group, but for your joke)

A ranger sniper found to possess such a weapon and such skills to shoot 2.25" groups at 800m would only be found on a (winning) Army competitive team and on the training course.

I pulled out a similar 1" grid sighting target. I took measurements based on the 175gr pattern and it was about 2.25" max group (at 800m). 800m = 874.89 yards Simple math is 2.25/8.75 = .25714 MOA at 100 yards So barely over 1/4" MOA from a semi-automatic! That is unbelievable. The military standard for the M110 is 1.1 MOA

Tighter groups than that at 800 meters!!? I don't think you are going to get any tighter. That looks like just over 2" with the 175's, which translates to just over 1/4 MOA. That is high end bolt action accuracy. What kind of barrel are you running?

These guys are part of a private training group. Guys with their own stuff that is not associated with whatever they do in their work life. Individually they might be police, mil, ex-mil/police, contractors, or just guys who like to shoot, (though the majority are all ex-something) but together they are just training and testing their own theories. I was one of those who ran a Grendel.

I build for tactical competitions and private group tactical training. I do not market to mil/LE, though they are at most of the competitons, as are many ex-mil guys. I mostly deal with the ex-mil guys who are trying to show up (teach) the "young'uns," and maybe relive some glory days. In fact, a quiet baby boomer that I run into from time-to-time shows up with an old, beat up Mosin Nagant and shoots open sights and consistently finishes in the top half of the pack. The only way anyone seems to beat him is on time, or when the targets are beyond 700ish.

Thanks, that stock was on my list.

YHM makes a QD brake for my suppressor. However, it will still only run with the suppressor mounted.

Sorry I wasn't more clear. The rifle is multi-purpose. It will be serving in different roles for different purposes. However, if it can accomplish the more difficult task of a spotter's battle rifle, then it will fill the other roles adequately, though likely on the heavy side. A lighter version of the M110 is what I was hoping to accomplish. In my opinion, this would allow the intermediate accuracy desired, while hopefully keeping the platform lighter for (non sniper related) training LRRPs (one of its separate roles where one might travel 12-18 miles in a round trip.) Part of the reason why accuracy is important is because in training it is not uncommon for an evolution to specify that the sniper's weapon suffers a malfunction in the heat of the moment, in which case either the spotter takes all of the targets (out to 1000), or the sniper takes over the spotter's weapon to accomplish the mission, or something similar. In the past, the snipers had been carrying 300 Win Mags, and the spotters were carrying 6.5 Grendel or 6.8 SPC SASS types, among a few others. This was causing a multitude of issues, so it was decided that all will carry .308s to mitigate most of the problems. Beyond all of this, I have a family of NBSs (natural born shooters), myself not being one of them. All of my children are pre-teen, and I want to get the older one's (and my petite wife) on a longer range platform, since they have already proven that consistently hitting a 12" plate at 500 with the .223 is "no big deal" for them - their words, not mine. Because I want to start pushing them out further, I need the recoil to be as light as possible so that they don't quit because of it. I was hoping to use this build for that purpose as well.

I already have a QD can...it goes on all of my rifles. I am not going to get a special one for this rifle.

Let me start from the top. As a dealer for many AR related parts from a few dozen manufacturers, and having spent the last seven years building and perfecting the AR-15 pattern rifle builds, I have only recently stepped into the fray on 308ARs because of accpeting one on a partial trade. I have found from closely examining the DPMS LR-308 Carbine, reading this forum, and conducting research with several manufacturers of AR paterned 308 parts, that the 308AR is not as simple as the AR-15. So what started off as a rebuild of the DPMS, has turned into a ground up build on the DPMS pattern. I need to build my first one, test, and improve where necessary. Purpose: • Taining • Spotter's battle weapon. Engage targets from 50-600 yards in support of sniper, with occasional targets 600-1000 yards. Requirements: • Weapon system will always operate suppressed • All ammo will be factory match 168gr • Weapon system must be carried on patrol, and fired from various positions, including off-hand, sitting/kneeling, and prone. • Unstable/moving supports in training are common • Lowest recoil possible while retaining reliable function From my reading, it seems that the DPMS pattern rifles require significant break-in. Can this be remedied, at least somewhat, with a Nickel Boron Bolt Carrier Group? Being always suppressed, what are the best options for mitigating recoil? For the above stated purposes, what would be your stock selection: Carbine or Rifle? Since the weapon system is also carried for patrols (somtimes as much as 12-18 miles in a single training day), weight is an issue. Without sacrificing long range accuracy, what is the best compromise barrel type, length, gas, etc.? At this point, the only parts I have purchased is an Aero Precision stripped upper/lower combo. I am dedicated to freefloating the barrel (likely with a 15" rail), and I have accesses to multiple vendors, and I will be using a Hiperfire 24E trigger group, as well as a bi-pod. Thanks for you thoughts and expertise.

This is a .223, not a .308, which is why I posted it in Black Rifles. From this platform, shooting 75 gr BTHP from the 20" barrel, the difference between 50 yards and 200 yards is -0.01 MOA which is effectively 0.0 inches

It's all I've got for free, and is a dead ringer for a 200 yard zero, which is what I was doing (zeroing the scope.) That way when I go to the 1000 yard range, I am not wasting ammo.

Uh, Oh! I better dig deeper into my spare parts bins. To be fair, that target was at 50 yards (for a 200 yard zero), but it is still sub MOA...barely!

Thanks guys. I was also using PPU 75 grain for that spread. I wonder what would happen if I used some Blackhills or Hornady match ammo.