.308 Lover

I have a DPMS LR .308 with a 24" barrel and I bought an AP4 upper for it. Any factory load shot in either barrel comes out with cratered primers. DPMS barrels are noted for extremely tight chambers. This makes is hard to work up a load when shooting a DPMS rifle. So I work up loads in other .308 rifles and consult several reloading manuals. If your load is within SAAMI specs it will be OK in your DPMS rifle. MY AP4 shoots just as good at the 24" stainless target barrel. It put British Radway Green military ball 147 gr. from the 1980's in three shots that a nickle could COMPLETELY COVER at 100 yards, and did it repeatedly. This ammo wasn't hot enough to work the action of my rifle. It didn't matter if the round came out of the magazine of if you laid it on top of the mag and released the locked-back bolt (you locked it back yourself) onto the round. No kinds of sesitivities as to how the round got into the chamber, it just put it right in there. Remington bought DPMS, I think in 2008. I only paid $850 for my .308 LR with stainless fluted barrel from RGuns in 2002. They are advertising them for $950 now, but they are always marked "out of stock". This is a dealer price, but I have a good friend who is a dealer. Have faith in your "Panther" rifle, it is a good one. Just be aware that you are going to see a lot of cratered primers.

I know a lot of people break in a barrel by shooting one shot and cleaning the barrel, then shooting two shots and cleaning the barrel, etc., up to 10 shots. This is a lot of work and time. I have what I think is a better way. Break your barrel in at home before you ever shoot your gun. Get some JB Bore Cleaner. First, mop out all of the dirt from the proof-load with the solvent of your choice. Then run some dry patches through your barrel until the barrel is dry. Next coat a tight-fitting patch with some Hoppes No. 9 bore cleaner. Coat that patch with the JB Bore cleaner. Run that patch through the bore and work your cleaning rod back and forth three to four inches while advancing the cleaning rod a few inches every few rubs. When you get this patch out of the barrel, get another patch and once again coat it with the Hoppes and the JB and repeat putting it through the bore as directed above. Do this with a third patch. Now clean all of the JB out of your bore with clean patches and Hoppes. Dry your bore and head for the range, your barrel is broken in. JB Bore Cleaner is like very fine lapping compound. This procedure takes a while to do and it is messy and takes a while to clean up. But I think it is better than going to the range and doing it the other way. When I go to the range I want to shoot, not clean my rifle 10 times.

Zero the Shepherd P2 range-finding scope at 100 yards with a Sierra 168 gr. Match bullet going 2700 fps and it is zeroed to 1000 yards without touching anything, except for windage. They also make a model set for the same bullet at 2500 fps for rifles with shorter barrels and semi-auto's and another for high velocities. I have 2 of them and I love mine.

Burris makes fine scopes. And if you have never tried Burris rings, they are tops. Their Signature Rings have plastic inserts in them so your scope won't get scratched. Plus, the plastic inserts come in various offsets so if your scope isn't true with your bore when it is mounted, you can true everything up by using combinations of their inserts. If you scope needs a lot of windage adjustment to zero at 100 yards, it won't be true at longer ranges. The Signature rings will take care of that. The price is very reasonable. The Signature "Z" rings are for Weaver-type bases

NSU...maybe.

Welcome, from one new guy to another. That is very nice of you to give great service to your customers. More companies should be like your's.

Thanks a lot for the advice based on experience. That is always the best kind of advice.

I had a good steak myself while I was in Cheyenne at the Cattleman's Steakhouse. Nice price, great steak. I hope to get back there again before I die. Love the historic town and the Rocky Mountains.

Last time I was in Indiana was on Labor Day in 2003. I was coming back from a 25 year Air Force reunion in Cheyenne, Wyoming. It was raining so hard in Indianapolis that at least three people were killed in traffic accidents by 6 PM. The guy on the radio said that this day was looking like it was going to set a record for most rain in one day in the area. It was really coming down hard and vehicles were hydoplaining all over the place, the one I was in included. Made it back home safe though.

So you are the primer guy! That's good. According to the story in Handloader, there are NO inaccurate primers. I like CCI primers because they fit tight in the primer pockets. I do use magnum primers for ball powder because of the coating of flame retardants they use on those powders. Have you had a primer change make a difference in accuracy in a load without ball powder?

Thanks so much. There is a great article in Handloader magazine this issue about primers. Have you seen it? There aren't many articles about primers. Sometimes you catch a story where they change from standard primers to magnum primes to see the velocity difference. Your load is very similar to mine (the one for my DPMS .308 LR) at 44.8 gr. Varget at 2722 fps. I'm getting crazy velocity out of my Browning BLR 20" barrel at 2732 fps and 2859 with LeveRevolution (48.8 gr.) with the Sierra Game King 165. I also got close to 2800 with IMR 4895, but the load is not too accurate and is a little too hot. I'm still experimenting. Soon will come out the DPMS .308 LR to test 147 gr. moly IMI bullets and 125 gr. moly Noslers. These don't want to shoot too well from the Browning. Maybe because of the 1 in 12" twist. I'll try them in 1 in 10" twist and see what happens.

How is the Sedona airport doing? Looks like you might have been there. Thanks for the welcome.

I have 2 of them, both P2's set for the Sierra Match King 168 gr. at 2700 fps. One is a 3.5X10.5, the other is a "varmint" 6X18. They are great scopes and worth every penny. I have had zero problems with them. Others I have shown them to love the features built into these scopes.

I like the range and the power of a .308. I have six .308 rifles. After buying a DPMS .308 LR with a 24" stainless fluted barrel, stuck a Leopold 4.5 X 14 Vari-X III scope on it and it shot groups of less that 1/2" (5 shots) at 100 yards, I wanted to see what others were doing with similar rifles. Varget powder and moly-coated 168 gr. Sierra Match Kings work for me.

I searched the internet for info about loads for .308's, especially in semi-auto rifles. I have a DPMS LR .308 with a 24" stainless fluted barrel for which I also purchased an AP4 16" upper. I installed a Chip McCormick trigger in this rifle. The 24" barrel wears a Leopold Vari-X III 4.5 to 14 power scope with Boone and Crockett crosshair and the 16" has a Valdada 3X CQB scope. Looks like a good place to be. Hope it doesn't fold. "Only accurate rifles are interesting"...Col. Townsead Whelen

Hi, folks. I'm 64 years old and have been reloading since 1972. I was into handguns or a long time, mostly .44 magnums, but lately my tastes have switched more to rifles, mainly in .308 caliber. I currently own six .308 rifles, four semi-auto's, one Browning BLR and a Remington VSS (Varmint Special Synthetic). Lately I have been shooting my Browning BLR, which I have accurized. It shoots really well now. I took off the 2X7 Burris mini-scope and put on a Shepherd P2 range-finding scope, the "Varmint" model in 6X18 just to shoot groups. It will go 3 shots in less than a half inch (and occasionally 5 shots too, if I do my part). The best load so far is 46.5 gr. (or 46 gr. of Varget) with 165 gr. Sierra "Game King" bullets. Velocity with the 46.5 gr. load in my 20" barrel is 2732 fps. The rest of the recipe for this load is WW cases and CCI 200 primers. Over-all length I keep to 2.80 inches to work in any of my rifles that has a magazine. This is not a maximum load in the BLR, but it is getting close with this powder. All of the .308 bullets I shoot are moly-coated. I will mention this in any load I put on this forum because moly-coated bullets can handle more powder (and give you more velocity and less barrel cleaning) than non-coated bullets. I know some people like the moly coating and some don't. I have used the spray moly and the powder and they are a little different. The powder is harder to apply but cleans easily. I haven't cleaned my barrel from shooting the BLR with the spray moly yet and I have about 100 rounds through it now. I hear that stuff is hard to clean out. Fortunately, that doesn't have to be done too often. Out of guilt, I cleaned my DPMS .308 LR after 150 rounds after using the powdered moly, but it really wasn't necessary yet. I also have been interested in trying the LeveRevolution powder in the .308. I have searched the web but I can find no evidence of anyone trying this powder in this caliber, though I may be wrong about this. I have tried this powder in the .308. As there is no loading data for this powder and the manufacturer does not recommend this powder for the .308, I had to come up with a place to start on my own. Looking in the 2013 Hodgdon "Annual Manual" at all the calibers for which this powder is used, I noticed that the max load for LeveRevolution powder is over 2 grains higher than the max load for Varget powder. So, as I am shooting 46.5 gr. of Varget with the moly-coated 165 Game King in my Browning BLR, I came up with what I thought should be a safe starting load of this bullet with 48 gr. of LeveRevolution. That worked so I have worked up to 48.8 gr. in Federal cases with Remington 9 1/2 magnum primers. Velocity with the 48.8 gr. of LeveRevolution powder is an average of 2859 fps from a 20" barrel. I think that is pretty amazing as velocity should be at least 100 fps more from a 24" barrel. This load puts a very small "crater" around the firing pin mark in my primer. In my Browning BLR this pretty much signifies a max load. I can barely feel the edge of the "crater" with my fingernail and it is barely visible unless you turn the primer to a 45 degree angle. Next is to get the DPMS .308 LR, 24" stainless fluted barrel out and work on the 125 gr. Noslers and the IMI 147 gr. FMJ's. My load of 44.8 gr. of Varget in Remington brass with a moly-coated (powder) Sierra MK 168 gr. bullet gives me 2722 fps in my Remington VSS and groups under 1/2" for five shots (.484 as near as I can measure it). This load shoots the same sized groups in my DPMS rifle, but I haven't clocked the load in that rifle. I put a Chip McCormick trigger in the DPMS rifle. It is non-adjustable and gives a 3 1/2 lb. pull. I have the single stage straight trigger. The factory trigger pull was 10 1/2 to over 11 lbs. Not good. On this rifle sits a Vari-X III Leopold 4 1/2 to 14X 30 mm tube and 50 mm objective with a Boone and Crockett reticle. The Remington VSS has a Shepherd 3.5 to 10.5 P2 scope on it, set from the factory for the Sierra 168 MK at 2700 fps. I really like the Shepherd scopes. No dots to count, no math to do. Just put the 18" range-finding circle on a deer from the top of his leg to the top of his back and shoot. If one circle is too big use the next smaller circle. If one circle is too big and the next circle is too small then hold between the circles and shoot. All you have to worry about is wind, which can be a problem at longer ranges. I'm especially interested in hearing if anyone else has tried the LeveRevolution powder in the .308. Remember, my loads are with moly-coated bullets with which you can use more powder than with non-coated bullets and that you use any internet loads (and really any loads at all) at your own risk. Always start lower with any load you see and try to verify the validity of any internet load with loading manuals from powder and bullet manufacturers. I'm glad to be here and I hope to make you folks happy to have me.