Loading machines

[6132expert]

Is there any disadvantages for someone just starting to reload to state with a  progressive loader

rather than a single stage loader?

[weaponizer]

Personally i would start with a single stage, it will give you a feel about whats going on in each step....As a guy who's been reloading since the early 70's i still use my single stage, for a number of reasons, especially load development...A lot of people think reloading is about quanity, when its really about quality...

[bgc]

A major disadvantage would be all the processes going on, it’s a lot to watch when learning.

And like weponizer, I find that the progressive loader is inherently less accurate that the single stage “O” press.

If you’re going for volume the progressive is great if you’re going for accuracy the press is better.  Just for the sake of argument, I use a Hornady LNL progressive and it is very precise but I can get much better results from my Redding single stage press.

[6132expert]

I can understand using a single press for load development, but over all and buying only one in my lifetime I have been thinking progressive. To be exact I have been thinking the Dillon XL650 or maybe the RL 550B. I am looking at accuracy but also want volume when I get the right recipe. I did think about just getting the basic dillon machine but I was like that just looks like to much work although it would be fantastic for manually loading the brass,bullet,powder..etc. Im not the guy who has much time to do things that I would or do enjoy between 4 kids and a crazy wife. I the guy who can afford to take a day and load 500 to 1000 rounds and if I am lucky do it agine in another month........lol

[Jgun]

I think you will be doing yourself a favor to buy yourself an inexpensive single stage, in order to get your load development done, should cost you under $100. and then you can also go for the Dillon for loading in volume after you've got your load down. after all, the dies are going to be usable for both, you need some sort of scale anyway, so the only thing specific to each would be the actual press and a powder drop. I personally like the 650 over the 550 because of the auto indexing. I had considered the 1050 but the caliber conversions and shell plates make switching calibers noticeably more expensive on the big machine, besides which I've been told that switching calibers takes longer on the big one as well.

[weaponizer]

I can understand using a single press for load development, but over all and buying only one in my lifetime I have been thinking progressive. To be exact I have been thinking the Dillon XL650 or maybe the RL 550B. I am looking at accuracy but also want volume when I get the right recipe. I did think about just getting the basic dillon machine but I was like that just looks like to much work although it would be fantastic for manually loading the brass,bullet,powder..etc. Im not the guy who has much time to do things that I would or do enjoy between 4 kids and a crazy wife. I the guy who can afford to take a day and load 500 to 1000 rounds and if I am lucky do it agine in another month........lol

First of all a crazy wife is no excuse, we all have one lol...I'm not too clear if you haven't reloaded before, so we'll assume you haven't...I have a RL650, and a RL450 (pre RL550) and 3 single stage presses, and you would be surprised how much you can load on a single stage, look, i'm not trying to say which one to get, but on a RL650 there's a lot going on when you pull that handle, and if you are not familar whats going on a disaster can occur, Murphy is always hanging around progressive presses, lol...You can buy a single stage press without spending much money, and buy the Dillon later on, you would still have to buy the other components ( dies, gunpowder,lube etc.)either way..

[6132expert]

HAHA, some wives are just crazier then others, but mine is good. As long as I/we can afford it she dont care what I bu or what I do( as long as it is with her )...lol anyhow I have been looking at this also http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct/?productNumber=820810

You are right! I have never done any reloading. I have never seen a reloading press in front of me and I have never laid a hand on any indivisual componets, but I know I would be good at it as I am with everything I do.

I can get a single stage press ordered today. What you guys say makes sence. I would be able to do a lot with a single, and get me a new Dillon is about 6 months or so.

What do you experianced  guys think of the Lee press and what comes with the kit?

[tjtorborg]

I agree with everyone who said to start with a single stage press.  It will teach you each step.  What to look for, what it looks like and most importantly how its supposed to feel.

I have a Rock Chucker sing stage and a Dillion 650.  The case feeder is a must for the 650.  Otherwise there isn't that big of an advantage of the 650 over the single stage.

The first thing you should buy is a reloading manual from a major mfr.  In the front it will walk you through the process step by step.

Just my $0.02

Tom

[6132expert]

The Lee comes with a manual and that was a big plus for it when I looked over it. I know I need morethan one manual and thats no problem. If the Lee will be a good one to get then nothing says I have to use it the day I get it.

[weaponizer]

Everyone here is giving you good info. Survivalshop should be along soon as he is an experienced reloader...

Now my .02 cents on Lee products, Lee products work, i especially like some of their dies, and they are inexpensive, but i never liked their presses, usually mostly aluminum, to me you need a cast iron press so there is no flex, you will know what i mean the first time you run a 30.06 through a die..If i was to get a first single type press i would get the RCBS rock chucker, to me its the king of single stage presses, even tho you are getting a Dillon you will always go back to this one trust me on that, and you will thank me later...As far as accessories go, i am  still buying stuff, after 40 years of reloading lol...You need a good scale to start with, i started with a beam (inexpensive ) and went to a RCBS digital, expensive but worth every penny for speed and accuracy, you will need a lube for rifle, i like the Dillon lube, if you are loading pistols get carbide dies, you will need a trimmer to trim the cases, a good digital caliper to measure, a tumbler or vibrater, and of course as tjtorborg mentioned a good reloading manual....There is much more and i'm sure others will chime in with their favorites

[Jgun]

I inherited that exact Lee press from a friend who had decided to stop loading. I have never tried loading .308 or anything larger on it. I have been using it for my 300 load development, but as weaponizer points out, it's not the beefiest thing out there. I find it up to the task for the 300 and probably would be OK for .223, but I can see where it might not be your best bet for larger rifle calibers. So if your buying it with the idea of loading for everything your building you might be disappointed. The beauty of the lee setup you posted, is that it is complete with most of what you need to get started. It might be a good "learner" set up for you, and then you can upgrade individual components as you can afford it, or come across good deals. I have not compared prices, but I doubt you can duplicate all those components individually for the price Midway is selling it for.

[hobbesgunner]

If you don't have any reloading equipment at all you'll be better off buying a press kit ...they come with everything to get you going...RCBS, Lyman, Redding all make fine single stage presses....if you don't buy quality the first go around you'll end up buying twice....Hogdens and Sierra  have nice binder type manuals out...lot of info in them.....you'll be surprised at how much you can get done with a single stage press.pulling the lever isn't the most time consuming part of loading....welcome to the loaders club and good luck

[imschur]

a lot of good advice in this thread. I would skip the Lee myself. As mentioned you'll end up buying twice. I also believe in dedicated presses for the high volume stuff as finances permit.

[weaponizer]

Another thing i would like to bring out is with an aluminum press is you will get so disgusted with pulling the handle,(its all about leverage and having a sturdy press) that you will hate reloading before you learn to love it, also i always mount my press to a steel plate then mount that to a very sturdy workbench...

[6132expert]

weapnizer mounting to a steal plate is a good idea and I have plenty of that. I am now looking at the hordany lock n load classic kit. It is quet a bit more $$$, I was really hoping the Lee would of been a good one so I could spend the other 200 bucks on cases primers and powder dies ..etc..etc , but if I am going to buy one I dont want to buy a single stage twice and definatly dont want to buy a progressive more then one time. The Lyman is out of the question as well as the RCBS. I had my wife ready to order the Lee a few ours ago , but told her to wait. I am not sure how she will feel about another 200 for the kit. I guess it may be a slow start, but all will work out in the end. I am in no hugh hurry to load anything!!

So whatdo yall think about the Hordany Lock n Load classic.

[bgc]

Ultimately you're going to get the reloader you want, right?

I have a handfull of safe queens that I wanted and three I use...... My Hornady LNL is sitting on the floor next to the reloading bench because it was in the way.....

[6132expert]

Ultimately you're going to get the reloader you want, right?

I have a handfull of safe queens that I wanted and three I use...... My Hornady LNL is sitting on the floor next to the reloading bench because it was in the way.....

Do you mind explaning yourself? IS the LNL in the floor because you dont like it? What 3 loaders is it you have that you use? I will get what I want as far as the Dillon goes, but I alo understand everyones point about a single. I want the Lee because the reviews I have read online say it can handle the job, its cheap, and its the color of blood...lol. I cant not afford to make a mistake so I would rather take advice from experianced folks then the word of a review that has probably be writen by the company who made the product, but at the same time I just am not going to pay the price of a Dillon 550 to get a single stage, nope just can not see it. I started out under a 100 bucks and now I am close to 300 buck. I know I have to pay to play and that is fine I just need to keep it as low cost as I can, the best bang for the buck if you will.

[weaponizer]

6132expert, have you considered used? usually used single stage presses are pretty inexpensive, just a thought..

[hobbesgunner]

Lee makes a cast iron press also....Classic Cast Press...check out www.factorysales.com........I know what everyone is saying about the aluminum models..full length sizing 308 mil brass with a crimped primer can be a struggle with the smaller lee press.. :P.a Rockchucker pops em out like it was built for it.....oh wait...it was built for it..

[imschur]

Used is a great idea. When I sold off my stuff some folks got great deals.

Reloading will become a hobby in itself. I think guys here are trying to prevent you from being disappointed. As you get in to it you will without a doubt come to realize why some of this stuff cost more. Reloading is all about accuracy, quality and consistency. You will find that cheap powder measures either choke or are not accurate with some powders. The scale needs to be accurate and repeatable as do your measuring tools. Die quality will affect your reloading experience.  I suggest visit a gun shop and fondle the hardware before you buy anything. Look at the quality and mass of the presses. Pay attention to the length, construction and leverage of the arms and any other moving parts. Play with the dies. Look at how they lock, how smoothly they adjust. Look inside at the finish. I think youll be surprised at the differences.

Currently I still own the redding boss. I was lucky years ago there was a company who sold Redding stuff relatively cheap in the shotgun news. Towards the end of my reloading career I pretty much used Redding dies with Dillon and RCBS for the stuff Redding didnt cover. At the time Dillon had the best dies for 5.56.  Not sure how all this stacks up in 2011.

lastly do you need to rush in? I treated it like a rifle build buying parts as I could afford them. When I started the total cost of ownership was mich higher then I had realized. I hadnt coonsidered I would need a heavier work bench and a lot of tools that werent apparant before I started. Lastly the componants themselves werent economical unless bought in bulk. Before I knew it I had 40000 primers, 1000's of bullets and bits of corn cob media everywhere.

[onebigelf]

For what it's worth I have a LEE Classic, the O-press, and I like it very much.  I also have an old iron 6-hole turret press.  Both presses were bought used, neither cost me more than about $30.  The turret press originally took proprietary shell holders, but the previous owner machined a ram for it that took standard holders.  The turret is not removable, but it with take 2 die rifle sets plus the factory crimp dies for .223 and .308 which is what I load in rifle calibers.  The other calibers I load are 9mm and a limited amount of 38 special.  I've done 30/06 for a co-worker as well (specialty loads for him).  The LEE handles the 30/06 fine and does most of my prep work in all of the calibers.  I have a friend with a Dillon that we use for large volume loading and it's a great piece of equipment, but I really only use it for the practice loads in 9mm and the bulk ball in .223.  With my .308 and my good loads in all calibers I use exclusively the simpler presses and do not find them at all limited.

My loading goes like this, for all calibers:

  LEE universal decapper in the LEE press.

  Clean the brass in the tumbler.

  Clean the primer pockets and uniform the flash hole.  Decrimp military brass

    using the RCBS swage tool if necessary.  This is a great time to carefully

    inspect every case and discard anything questionable.

  Full-length resize cases.

  Trim cases to length, deburr and chamfer.

  Reprime using a LEE Auto-prime II.

Cases at this point get sorted and stored on the shelf in tightly sealed 1 gallon jars.  From here all I do is measure my powder charge, seat the bullet, and crimp.  This set of steps is about as easily done on a single stage press as a progressive.  Easier actually, as you can't do the trim and primer pocket work in a progressive cycle.

John

[6132expert]

[lastly do you need to rush in? I treated it like a rifle build buying parts as I could afford them. When I started the total cost of ownership was mich higher then I had realized. I hadnt coonsidered I would need a heavier work bench and a lot of tools that werent apparant before I started. Lastly the componants themselves werent economical unless bought in bulk. Before I knew it I had 40000 primers, 1000's of bullets and bits of corn cob media everywhere.

[Jgun]

I thought I'd expand on what I last posted. As stated, I have a Dillon XL650, which was my first loader and purchased to load large quantities of pistol ammo for competition. It is a great machine and I don't regret for a minute buying it. I have yet to load anything other than pistol cals on it. I ended up with the Lee single stage as a gift, I certainly don't think it would be my choice if I were going out to buy a new single stage with loading for rifle cals in mind. The Lee has an 812" dia ram compared to the Dillon's 1.5" ram.  Of course, the Lee only has the resistance of one action taking place on each upstroke while the progressive is sizing/depriming, priming, flaring/charging, seating, and crimping at 5 different stations simultaneously, so there is much more resistance felt loading 9mm on the progressive than I encounter forming and loading 300 BLK on the Lee.  That being said, I'd consider the Lee aluminum to be "adequate" for loading pistol cartridges, but not ideal for rifle. I have not done any precision loading for 7.62 but expect to for my planned M1A. As far as coming to love loading, I'm still waiting for that to happen but it seems that for making specific loadings for what we're trying to do with these guns, there is no alternative. I have yet to see any kind of financial savings from loading, just the ability to get ammo matched to my gun/planned use with oal matched to my chamber. Something I can't buy anywhere. I am following your thread with great interest because, although I have the other tools I need, I will eventually be needing to purchase a heavier single stage myself in the future and just as you, I don't wish to buy more press than I need. IMO, You have two choices, either purchase a loading "kit" that will have everything you need (but not the highest quality components) and you'll be on your way to educating yourself to what loading is all about, and then upgrading as you go when the limitations  of certain components start to hold you back, and you've become more knowledgeable so are better able to judge what is what as far as quality and price go, or you can wait, and either buy a component at a time, or save until you can afford to buy a higher end "kit". I, personally, was not interested in loading, and put it off as long as possible, and now regret that I didn't start sooner. Because as we all know, there's no substitute for experience, of which I need to gain much more.

[6132expert]

OK, I have to ponder on all this now. The next time I post in this thread will be wth pictures of what I get.

Yall can keep posting and I will read but I have to take it in and do some research, I would love to walk into a gun shop and check out different loaders but that just is not going to happen around here. I may need to ride up to Chattanooga and see what is up there.

[fr3db3ar]

I only reload for 223, 308 and 357.  I do it all with a Lee hand press.  You'll work your chest muscles a bit full length sizing 308 though  <laughs>.  Like was said earlier...the lengthy part of reloading isn't putting the bullets in.  I prefer to powder measure all by hand for accuracy (I'm still working on that part  ;D  ) 

It seems most of the time consuming part of reloading is prepping the brass

I spend a night sizing, a night in the tumbler for really dirty brass ( not a necessity but shiney brass looks perdy  ;D

an evening priming with hand primer then I can load about 60 or 80 in a couple hours.

So you see, even though you might not have a lot of time to spend on it at any given time, even with a hand press you can load several hundred in a week.

Now I don't shoot tons so that's way more than I usually load and shoot.

YMMV