Matt.Cross Posted August 19, 2011 Report Share Posted August 19, 2011 Well, Drew has finally done me in with his thread detailing his journey into proud suppressor ownership.I've found a fellow that helps North Carolinians to legally obtain and own suppressors without unbearable hassle. This thread will serve to document my own trip down the "slow road to sound suppressors" <thumbsup> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imschur Posted August 19, 2011 Report Share Posted August 19, 2011 Good luck Matt <thumbsup> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt.Cross Posted August 22, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 22, 2011 Dear Diary,Oh wait, nevermind, wrong window.... <dontknow>Well, today I got an e-mail back from the gentleman who is acting as the 'guide' on my journey to suppressed firing:Hi Matt,Thanks for the kind words!I'm waiting to hear back from Ops Inc. to get their latest dealer pricing. I actually just got off the phone with Ron who heads up the manufacturing for Ops Inc. He shared some good info about your proposed mockup. Sounds like you've done your homework and know what you want regarding that brake/suppressor setup. I'll get back to you on specific pricing for that suppressor combo when I have the price list in hand.As far as other cost, it's really just the NC sales tax on the suppressor, and of course the $200 tax stamp. I don't charge for handling the paperwork and I offer a Trust template for free to whoever wants to go that route. If you're certain that your sheriff or CLEO will sign off on your ATF Form 4, you won't need to create a Trust.The process is pretty straight forward. It just requires patience. The short version is like this:1. Pay me for the suppressor. 2. I order the suppressor. Also at this point, I mail you everything you need to fill out, complete with detailed instructions.3. You put pen to paper, and send it all back to me. 4. I sign off and insert the serial number of the suppressor (often, I have the suppressor in hand at this point. If not, I at least have the SN ready to record on Form 4)5. I send everything off to the ATF and we wait.6. Two to three months later, I get your approved Form 4 and paid tax stamp back from the ATF.7. You pick up your new suppressor and tax stamp!You may have other questions regarding certain specifics.... like perhaps, "can I ship your suppressor to you, or do you have to pick it up in person?" (a lot of people ask about that). By the way, the answer to that is kind of complicated. I like to play it safe and do the final transaction face to face.If you do have other questions, feel free to ask. I'll do my best to help answer your questions. -- Thanks,Eric Morton Sounds pretty simple to me. Now, what should we rename Frank to once he's rebuilt?Updates will follow as they come. 8) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edgecrusher Posted August 23, 2011 Report Share Posted August 23, 2011 I vote for the violator, <thumbsup> <munch> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted August 23, 2011 Report Share Posted August 23, 2011 Matt, check into what that guy is talking about, in regards to... "I don't charge for handling the paperwork and I offer a Trust template for free to whoever wants to go that route."Ask him specifics about this. Details. If he's talking about a Quicken trust, or other software-based "creat your own" document, it won't work. BATFE has deemed these not-legal, as far as the purpose of creating an NFA Trust (which is what you need). You're better off paying a lawyer that specializes in, or is at least familiar with, the NFA Trust process. Read some of this stuff here:http://www.guntrustlawyer.com/?gclid=CJeOlPCm5KoCFUpjTAodRXyS7A Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imschur Posted August 23, 2011 Report Share Posted August 23, 2011 I just started two topics after reading this post as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt.Cross Posted August 23, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 23, 2011 You've managed to root out the ace up my sleeve, there is a local gun store with a NFA lawyer on retainer. I have told them about my build and they are double verifying my information. This guy has a website that you guys can check out and tell me what you think: www.ncsilencer.comI'm going to try my best to make sure I don't get myself in a bind on this deal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imschur Posted August 23, 2011 Report Share Posted August 23, 2011 I think you cant be too careful. My trust cost me $500. It not only helps with the accessories but it also lays out what happens to my firearms in case of legal trouble, arrest, divorce, incapacitation and death etc. Example: A disgruntled wife says you threatened her. Cops cant confiscate the guns. They belong to the trust not the individual. They (the guns) go to the next person on the trust until the situation is remedied. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted August 23, 2011 Report Share Posted August 23, 2011 Amen. Matt, you're in a unique situation, with the dealer having a relationship with the attorney - so many times, it's nothing like that. There are alot of dealers that think the Quicken (or similar) trust documents are the way to go, and "easy." That doesn't work with the firearms, and what people aim to accomplish the a Gun Trust or NFA Trust. Glad you've got it sorted out, but you had me worried... <dontknow> <laughs>Edit - upon checking out the link you provided, you need to find out exactly what that dealer is talking about - I've never, ever seen a lawyer work for "free," but your dealer is offering the trust setup for free. I have no idea how that's even possible. He paid for an attorney, but he passes this on to you for free? Check in to this, brother. Find out what's going on before you completely put all your eggs in this basket... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imschur Posted August 23, 2011 Report Share Posted August 23, 2011 My guess is they have a trust either created for somebody and they duped it to fill in the blanks per customer or they have a real generic trust created for a fill in the blanks application. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt.Cross Posted August 23, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 23, 2011 I hope I didn't muddy the waters any, the NFA lawyer and the NCSilencer guy as far as I know have nothing to do with each other. The gun store is setting up to sell NFA items, they are keeping the lawyer on retainer to write their trusts up. I'm going through the NCSilencer guy and using the NFA lawyer to proofread my paperwork. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt.Cross Posted August 23, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 23, 2011 Update: Checking up on my suppressor man has yielded positive results. I have talked to him now in person and I have a couple of references to check out that can vouch for him. He has given me info to get in touch with regular customers and business associates. So far everything is checking out but be assured, I'm taking no chances. Going to try to meet with the local sheriff here soon and negate the need for the trust route, but be assured, I'm working both angles as thoroughly as possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imschur Posted August 23, 2011 Report Share Posted August 23, 2011 Good to know... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted August 24, 2011 Report Share Posted August 24, 2011 Did you ask him what this trust template consists of? I'm just sayin', if it's on Quicken or something similar, it's going to get rejected by BATFE. You'll find out when they send the rejected Form 4 back to you. I'm not trying to down the guy, just trying to find out more info, and save you some grief. It really won't matter how many references he has, or how many happy customers he has, if all their stuff passed through BATFE before they started rejecting this medium of a "trust" as a viable NFA Trust document. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt.Cross Posted August 24, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 24, 2011 Did you ask him what this trust template consists of? I'm just sayin', if it's on Quicken or something similar, it's going to get rejected by BATFE. You'll find out when they send the rejected Form 4 back to you. I'm not trying to down the guy, just trying to find out more info, and save you some grief. It really won't matter how many references he has, or how many happy customers he has, if all their stuff passed through BATFE before they started rejecting this medium of a "trust" as a viable NFA Trust document. It's not a computer-generated trust template. I don't want to tell you more than I know, especially before I actually have some paperwork in hand and can tell you with certainty. Until then ultimately ANYTHING I think I know is sheer conjecture. Having dropped that disclaimer, here's what I think I know:He has a trust document drawn up by a lawyer (a 'template'), your personal information, preferences, and other specifics are added to or optionally omitted from this document, which will in it's barest form still meet the legal requirements. The complexity is mostly up to you, but essentially you're going to fill in the blanks, thus the 'template' moniker. He gave me the names of customers who buy regularly and frequently, and gave me the name of the officer with the BATFE who usually handles his transfers, and encouraged me to speak with them. So far his customers are checking out but I haven't called up his BATFE contact yet. I'm using suggestions from this thread to compile into an e-mail to send to him to get everything cleared up once I know what all I need to ask. Beside my gun store buddies, the only NC NFA Trust lawyers I'm finding are via the 'Web, at some point I'm going to have to trust that one of them is who they say they are. If this guy fails to check out completely, I will keep looking elsewhere. Though I may well be wrong, I think I have a pretty good chance with this guy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imschur Posted August 24, 2011 Report Share Posted August 24, 2011 All this stuff makes you realize just how silly the process is. They should simplify the process and generate more revenue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt.Cross Posted August 24, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 24, 2011 I've pretty well steered this thread into being a heavy discussion about whether or not i'm being defrauded. I had hoped it would be a somewhat lighter thread at the outset. It's still good to know what I need to be asking though, I don't relish the thought of ending up in the federal pen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imschur Posted August 24, 2011 Report Share Posted August 24, 2011 It's important dialog though for others interested. One of the things my attorney made very clear that even though the laws and requirements are spelled out thoroughly some examiners use their own judgment and interpretation of the laws and requirements. The second time I met with him he showed me some evidence of one examiner being just a bit more difficult then others. This is why youll see debates on whether to include copies of the actual trust when legally only the declaration is required. Now that examiners are determined by location and not random some of this will improve as both sides get to know each other. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted August 24, 2011 Report Share Posted August 24, 2011 It sounds better and better, Matt - it wasn't sounding too good at the beginning, though, and I'm just being honest. I'd hate to see somebody get all fired up about this, happy and all, only to be "rejected" as a final outcome - with that based on bad info from someone selling product.It has happened alot, or there never would have been an article about it, that Drew linked here. I'm sure everything will work out, but it wasn't sounding too good in the beginning, buddy. I rushed to judgment about it, but it sounded like so many other stories out there that don't end too well for the purchaser. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt.Cross Posted August 24, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 24, 2011 It sounds better and better, Matt - it wasn't sounding too good at the beginning, though, and I'm just being honest. I'd hate to see somebody get all fired up about this, happy and all, only to be "rejected" as a final outcome - with that based on bad info from someone selling product.It has happened alot, or there never would have been an article about it, that Drew linked here. I'm sure everything will work out, but it wasn't sounding too good in the beginning, buddy. I rushed to judgment about it, but it sounded like so many other stories out there that don't end too well for the purchaser. No need to feel bad, I was getting a little bent out of shape thinking about all my research and effort going down the drain. A little dose of reality does a body good, I'm no exception. <thumbsup>I talked with my county's sheriff on the phone today. I'm going to talk to him in person at 9am Friday morning. Keep your fingers crossed that we'll hit it off and not need to go the trust route. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt.Cross Posted August 24, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 24, 2011 In my search for more information, I found a YouTube page with some interesting video:http://www.youtube.com/user/MrNCSILENCERThis is definitely the guy I spoke with on the phone... I'm sending him another e-mail now to ask specifically about the trust. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edgecrusher Posted August 25, 2011 Report Share Posted August 25, 2011 so jealous Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt.Cross Posted August 25, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 25, 2011 so jealousNo need to be jealous, I don't know how it's going to work out just yet. Speaking of which, I'm seriously sweating what to say to the Sheriff, besides introducing myself and explaining why I want him to sign off on a suppressor purchase. How do you lead into that without someone you don't know and never speak to? <dontknow> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imschur Posted August 26, 2011 Report Share Posted August 26, 2011 No need to be jealous, I don't know how it's going to work out just yet. Speaking of which, I'm seriously sweating what to say to the Sheriff, besides introducing myself and explaining why I want him to sign off on a suppressor purchase. How do you lead into that without someone you don't know and never speak to? <dontknow> Ill bet he starts the conversation, youll be fine. As a back up you can bring flowers and give him a peck on the cheek Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edgecrusher Posted August 26, 2011 Report Share Posted August 26, 2011 tell him the truth, they help reduce the noise impact on your ears, and shooting is your hobby and you would like to continue to do so without hurting your physical well being. suppressors also allow you to develope different loads for your rifles bettering accuracy and although i'm not quite sure maybe run loads that will lessen wear. be yourself and truthful. he'll see right through you if not, and you want to earn this mans respect so look him in the eye and you be gtg. i'm just jealous i can't get this opportunity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.