Spaniky73 Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 Every time I clean my rifle after shooting it I keep finding brass shaving in the chamber and around the BCG. This is happening with any rounds that I shoot (surplus, factory or reloads). The shaving jammed up my ejector to the point I would stove pipe every round. <dontknow> Is this a common thing with the LAR-8 or just my rifle? Also is there a way to keep it from creating the shavings? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMoto Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 It could be either the ejector or extractor. I had some very sharp edges on my ejector and took a stone and just honed the edged off. Been much better since then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoot Posted January 8, 2012 Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 The ejector spring is so strong on my bolt that it pressed the cases into the sharp edges of the barrel extension lugs during cycling, with enough force as to shave and deeply scratch brass from the cases. Not sure why RRA uses such a powerful ejector spring. I melted off all the sharp outside edges on the lugs and that helped. I searched high and low through my extensive spring stock, but could not fine one with the right dimensions, but less force. I eventually took off a turn or two from the original spring and the combination of those two actions stopped shaving significant amounts of brass off of the cases, not to mention carving them up. My ejected brass now falls next to my shooting position at the range, instead of 5 positions down from me. Since I reload, I normally use a brass catcher, but I took it off for testing.If you're unfamiliar with the term melting off, it is as Jmoto suggested, stoning off the sharp edges. I prefer chucking the barrel in a barrel vise, pulling on my magnifier visor and pulling up a chair. Then, I use grit impregnated rubber polishing points in a rotary tool to slowly, carefully, efface the edges. Rubber polishing points are a godsend. They are not for folks who are patience challenged though. ;)Hoot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spaniky73 Posted January 8, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 8, 2012 I have no issues with breaking down my rifle as far as I need, but when it comes to altering the shape of something I need to see it done before I will even contemplate attempting it. Is there a video of this process (I'm a visual learner) or should I just take it to a gunsmith? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unforgiven Posted January 9, 2012 Report Share Posted January 9, 2012 How many rounds ya got thru rifle brother Spaniky ? Have you had this issue from day one? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unforgiven Posted January 9, 2012 Report Share Posted January 9, 2012 Brother Spaniky looked at my log have put 350 rds. thru RRA Lar-8 took a pic of last cases fired extraction varies,the tech at RRA Randy said spring is tight to aid in extraction [relative to question I had about extractor was hard to reassamble after cleaning] samples are Dag,Winchester some have light burr some nothing.Have not found any brass shavings ever, on either BCG or chamber.Good pic was hard to get from flash reflecting off brass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
planeflyer21 Posted January 9, 2012 Report Share Posted January 9, 2012 I'm not experiencing that with the RR Operator I currently have, though I do see some of the scratches on the brass, mentioned by Hoot.Whenever I clean it, I take a tool and squash the ejector up and down a few times. It does seem to be "breaking in".Jon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spaniky73 Posted January 9, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 9, 2012 I am sitting in the 300rd range. I get the bur near the primer on every round (New, reload or surplus). I have gotten the shavings since day one. I would work the ejector when I cleaned it but this last time I took it out to the range I was about 60rds in then it started stove piping every round. I pulled BCG and looked at the bolt the ejector was stuck down. I took it home pulled the ejector's pin and cycled the action a few times until the ejector was far enough out that I could grab it with some pliers. I found a lot of shavings in there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unforgiven Posted January 9, 2012 Report Share Posted January 9, 2012 Brother Spaniky,sounds like your problem went from bad to worse.The pin to extractor only goes in one way,factory crimp on other end for keeper.Call RRA they stand by products,don't know how many techs they have usually talk to Randy.Will follow your thread. <dontknow> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoot Posted January 10, 2012 Report Share Posted January 10, 2012 I suspect you are seeing a lesser version of this:My Predator HP had this from the first round on. I broke in the barrel with 7.62 NATO rounds that were pretty tame as 308 loads go, averaging around 2600 fps over the chrony. Every case had a swipe. I approached it as if over-gassing was making the bolt unlock before the case had released from the cylinder. A common solution for this is to install an adjustable gas block. I bought and tried one, but as soon as it was adjusted enough to allow the bolt to start to cycle, I got the same swipes. Besides the ejector swipes on the faces, there was fine brass residue in the bolt face recess.I then increased the buffer weight to further retard the unlocking moment, but to no avail, whether alone or in combination with the adjustable block.It occurred to me that I might be over-thinking the problem. I removed the bolt, disassembled it, chucked a piece of useless, spent, berdan primed, milsurp 7.62 case in the drill press, base down. I then drizzled some 600 grit lapping compound on the bolt face and pressed it up into the slowly rotating case carefully maintaining a square relationship between the two mating surfaces. I retracted the bolt occasionally to freshen up the lapping compound and to inspect the bolt face.Once the parkerizing or whatever treatment they do the bolt with, had effaced and the bolt face was smooth, I cleaned it up, reassembled everything and headed out to the range. It only took a couple of shots to confirm that the swiping had stopped.Several trips later, before it got too cold, utilizing different loads, some more stout, some less, the swiping has never returned. There must have been a sharp edge on the ejector hole, though I could not detect it under the stereo microscope and the lapping got rid of it.There are a number of ways to the same end result. I chose one way. You might consider some process at your disposal, to try, that accomplishes the same thing. Keep in mind that I did not remove much, if any actual metal from the bolt face, other than that which was raised above the flat surface of it. That is important so as not to alter the headspacing detrimentally. I removed the adjustable gas block, but I kept the additional buffer weight as it tamed the recoil impulse a little and the spent brass doesn't seem to get as beat up during extraction.If in doubt go slow and retest frequently. Like my barber used to say, "I can always take more off, but I can't put it back on."Hoot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unforgiven Posted January 10, 2012 Report Share Posted January 10, 2012 Brother Hoot does the scuff marks as shown or slight burr affect reloading those cases,I'm saving my brass for that time ? The scuffing has dimished quite a bit the more rounds I have put thru Lar-8. <dontknow> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted January 10, 2012 Report Share Posted January 10, 2012 That is the classic story heard about the RRAs. There are accounts all over that the ejector takes some time to "break in." Some of the things I've seen are that it needs 60 rounds, 100 rounds, etc. That's the first time someone has posted up a pic of how extensive it is. Hoot, how many rounds were through your rifle when you took that pic of the cases? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoot Posted January 10, 2012 Report Share Posted January 10, 2012 That is the classic story heard about the RRAs. There are accounts all over that the ejector takes some time to "break in." Some of the things I've seen are that it needs 60 rounds, 100 rounds, etc. That's the first time someone has posted up a pic of how extensive it is. Hoot, how many rounds were through your rifle when you took that pic of the cases?Those were the first rounds through it as I did a barrel break-in on day one. The residue of a gas impingement system, combined with the spent cases grinding it into the bolt face would probably accomplish the same thing over time, but I reload my brass and use swiping as a troubleshooting aid in determining if I may have gone a few granules past max for a given powder / bullet combination. As such, did not want all my brass bearing the scars it took to efface the burr through a war of attrition.Though visually obvious, the depth of the swipes was so slight as to barely be detectable by feel with your fingernail. It did not have any lasting adverse effect upon reloading them. I eventually spun each of the case heads into a 0000 steel wool pad in the palm of my hand to get rid of the swipes. Now, I can't even tell which ones they were. Still, it was a disquieting initial experience for my first AR 7.62 platform.Hoot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted January 10, 2012 Report Share Posted January 10, 2012 Does yours still do this, after that intial run-in? Cases ejecting fine now, without those marks?Since there's actual "photographic proof" now, I'm just trying to get my head around the issues with that ejector, as it comes stock... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spaniky73 Posted January 10, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 10, 2012 Hoot, You are saying that the shavings that I am getting are from the swipe that the ejector is making. I will have to see what the base hobby shop has available for tools. All my tools are back home in Salt Lake. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoot Posted January 10, 2012 Report Share Posted January 10, 2012 Does yours still do this, after that intial run-in? Cases ejecting fine now, without those marks? Since there's actual "photographic proof" now, I'm just trying to get my head around the issues with that ejector, as it comes stock... Was that directed at me or Spaniky73?Mine stopped doing it after I lapped the bolt face.HootYou are saying that the shavings that I am getting are from the swipe that the ejector is making. I will have to see what the base hobby shop has available for tools. All my tools are back home in Salt Lake.No, I'm suggesting that may be the cause. There are certainly other causes for brass shavings in a receiver. That barrel extension is enough to put fear in the hearts of brass manufacturing men itself. That crazy stiff ejector spring is total overkill. FAL magazines...well need I say more? The culprits are endless. ;)Hoot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spaniky73 Posted January 10, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 10, 2012 Well for now I am just going to have to keep it as clean as possible until I can get it in the shop or to someone that knows a lot more than me. Thank you all for the info. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted January 11, 2012 Report Share Posted January 11, 2012 Was that directed at me or Spaniky73?That was for you, brother - good to see the issue is resolvable. Excellent. <thumbsup> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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