Jgun Posted June 8, 2011 Report Share Posted June 8, 2011 I was out at the range today sighting in, and there was another shooter there with a Springfield M1A .308. He let me try it out and I was very impressed. I was wondering if any members could clue me in as to what are the more desirable types, models, What stocks do people prefer? I see that they have a pistol grip stock for it (this one was not a PG model) does anyone have the PG stock, can you comment on it? Any barrel type/length recommendations? The one I tried had been rebarreled with a Krieger barrel and was VERY accurate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edgecrusher Posted June 8, 2011 Report Share Posted June 8, 2011 i noticed fulton armory has some, springfield armory and i hear the socom receiver is the set to build off from a guy who is way into m1/ m14 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imschur Posted June 8, 2011 Report Share Posted June 8, 2011 Fulton used to offer them in this Troy stock Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jgun Posted June 8, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 8, 2011 I also see that JAE has a nice looking stock (not exaxtly pistol grip but tactical) that you can order ala cart so you only oder the features/rails you want. I'm going to have to do some studying of this platform, and see if any other members in my club have them, so maybe I can get some more trigger time. Thanks for the input. http://www.jallenenterprises.com/customer_pictures.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jgun Posted June 8, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 8, 2011 another thing I was wondering about, The one thing I didn't like about the gun I tried today was the trigger, Every single AR I have has a better trigger. do you guys know if I can buy a trigger for one of these the way we do for the AR's? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMoto Posted June 9, 2011 Report Share Posted June 9, 2011 Mcmillan also makes a pistol grip stock for it. M1a is my favorite rifle, I actually have been taking it out almost every time I take the LR 308 out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jgun Posted June 9, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 9, 2011 Can you tell me how yours is configured? What barrel length. What things you like or would like to change? Do you know if there are aftermarket triggers available, and if so which are most highly regarded? If I were to get one I'd plan to mount a scope, so I also need to investigate rail/mount options. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMoto Posted June 10, 2011 Report Share Posted June 10, 2011 Were you speaking to me? Mine is actually a custom build, it started out as a receiver and a barrel blank. Blank was cut to 22in and oversized heavy barrel, op-rod guide had to be welded to the bottom of the barrel because of the size. All NM/GI parts. I do not think there is an aftermarket trigger group available. You just have to rework the factory one. When it comes to scope mounts you will HAVE to spend the money. I have tried every single cheap one there is and it cost me way more to find one that worked... sort of. Word to the wise, the trijicon mount will NOT clear a national match rear sight hood. I ended up giving that one to my brother since his has standard sights. It is bedded into an old fiberglass stock.Mine is a dream to shoot, in all honesty my favorite gun to shoot and to show. I would not change a thing on it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted June 10, 2011 Report Share Posted June 10, 2011 Fulton Armory is one of the pioneers in M1A accuracy. Clint can tune those guns. <thumbsup> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jgun Posted June 10, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 10, 2011 JMOTO, After a description like that you don't even post a picture? I think your teasing me. I have been told that the LRB receivers are of high quality, do you know anything pro or con about them? Could you tell me who's receiver you built on? I see that Krieger does a lot of work on them as well, and I really like the Kreiger barrels. I did an online search and see reports that it's possible to tune one of these triggers down to below 2 lbs, but that due to the design, a 3 lb M1A trigger feels more like a 2 lb AR trigger. I think I must be getting restless because I don't presently have any new gun builds going on . the other option would be for me to build a dedicated benchrest .308 AR, which would probably be 10 X easier, but less fun than exploring a new platform. I hear that it's harder to get extreme accuracy from the M1A because the barrel is non free float. Can you tell me how well your gun groups with it's favorite load? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMoto Posted June 11, 2011 Report Share Posted June 11, 2011 Smith Enterprise bar stock receivers are rolling around out there. just under a grand if you so choose. Mine is on a 2 lugged armscorp. My trigger pack is at about 2.7 lbs on mine. Just like any rifle you can change the way the trigger feels but the way you hold it. Some people hold the rifle with their thumb up against the back of the receiver pointing downrange. Compare this to shooting with your thumb wrapped around the stock and others will keep their thumb on the right side of the gun while firing. All three of these positions will make the trigger pull feel different, but to say that 2lbs on this is like 3lbs on that.... really cannot say. Which is heavier? 1lb of feathers or 1lb of stones. There is more to a trigger job then the weight of pull, and I think many times people forget or don't understand that.The barrel is not free floated, but you can "float" the handguard and remove tension here and there, but there will still be a contact point or two. When shooting you want to try and be consistent. For instance, if it is a highpower gun do most of your testing and development in high power positions. If you are going to shoot from a bench with sandbags test it as such including your load development. If you test the load from sandbags but you do most of your shooting from a bipod the pressure(s) on the barrel are different and the load may not be optimal for that set up. Now the difference is minute but if you are trying to shoot for groups, all the little things count. I just shot a 5 shot group the other day that was less than .5in during load development. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jgun Posted June 11, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 11, 2011 I was not aware of the Smith Enterprises receivers but will check them out, thanks. I did look online at the LRB, which seem to have a good reputation, besides being located about 15 minutes away from me? I see that their receivers are hammer forged and they also have a very unique dovetail setup machined into the top of one of their receivers that takes a picatinny rail (included) which is a very solid and also low mount for an optic (which I plan to use instead of iron sights) I see that the M1A receivers are available with and without the rear lug. The consensus seems to be that the rear lug makes for a more solid receiver/stock interface if glass bedding, but certain stocks don't accept the rear lug receivers, the Sage being one. I think that I would like to go with the JAE, which at this point I'm not sure of as far as rear lug compatibility goes. Do you think I'd be giving up a lot in the accuracy department by going with a non glass bedded stock, specifically the JAE? I also don't see any one bolt that seems to be "THE" preferred one. I see guys talking about the TRW mfg'd bolts but they are not available so you would have to come across a NOS. I see that Clint at Fulton has pretty much anything I need, and as 98Z5V mentioned, they have a very good rep when it comes to the M1A's. I'm thinking of this as something that I would shoot off the bench using a bipod, so weight is not a consideration here, accuracy and ergonomics are my two main considerations. and since I'm not a purist, I have no issues with using aftermarket vs USGI parts. I would just want to use the best parts available, and not cut any corners, so as to end up with the most accurate M1A possible. Not to be a nag, but how about showing a picture of yours? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMoto Posted June 11, 2011 Report Share Posted June 11, 2011 nag nag nag... you guys and your pictures lol. I will send you some, but it looks like a bomb went off in the work area so they wont be pretty. I will PM them to you lolThe rear lug helps preserve the bedding job like you mentioned. I have no personal experience with all of the cool guy stocks so I cannot speak of their accuracy. Fulron and lrb both have good reps and I have and still do use some of their products. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jgun Posted June 11, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 11, 2011 Don't worry, I won't be looking at the work area just the gun. I find that when I take an interest in a new (to me) firearm, it helps me to develop a general idea of visually what type of gun I want to go with , by looking at as many diffirent pictures of all of the varients, before I actually get serious about starting a build. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weaponizer Posted June 28, 2011 Report Share Posted June 28, 2011 M1A, MN-E2 stock...Uploaded with ImageShack.us Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jgun Posted June 28, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 28, 2011 beautiful rifle. As I attempt to educate myself about these rifles,I'm finding that there seem to be a lot of traditionalists out there that have very strong opinions with regards to what parts are appropriate to use when building one. It would appear that the old timers feel very protective about these guns. I've had people go so far as to tell me that it's sacrilegious to install one of them in anything other than a USGI stock. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
imschur Posted June 28, 2011 Report Share Posted June 28, 2011 Wow....beautiful Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMoto Posted June 29, 2011 Report Share Posted June 29, 2011 beautiful rifle. As I attempt to educate myself about these rifles,I'm finding that there seem to be a lot of traditionalists out there that have very strong opinions with regards to what parts are appropriate to use when building one. It would appear that the old timers feel very protective about these guns. I've had people go so far as to tell me that it's sacrilegious to install one of them in anything other than a USGI stock.Many of them are the same ones that won't shoot theirs or cannot hit water if they fell out of a boat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
weaponizer Posted June 29, 2011 Report Share Posted June 29, 2011 Actually, that is a USGI stock, ;D but i know what you mean, i switch back and forth with the regular one, as far as traditionalists go, they should have seen the aray of different things guys did to them in Vietnam...Thanks for the nice comments... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jgun Posted June 30, 2011 Author Report Share Posted June 30, 2011 Weaponizer, I wasn't refering to your GI pistol grip stock, I was talking about the responses I get from some people when I try to discuss the Sage EBR or JAE stocks, Or when I say that I'd like to use a Surefire comp or one of those gas block mounted aftermarket SOCOM type sights instead of the original setup as on your gun. I don't think I'm to the point yet, where my taste is sophisticated enough when it comes to the M1A's, that I have a problem using newly designed componets to build one of these. Of course, if I already had one of the early ones in good condition, I don't think I'd want to compromise it's history/originality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H2O MAN Posted August 5, 2011 Report Share Posted August 5, 2011 I was out at the range today sighting in, and there was another shooter there with a Springfield M1A .308. He let me try it out and I was very impressed. I was wondering if any members could clue me in as to what are the more desirable types, models, What stocks do people prefer? I see that they have a pistol grip stock for it (this one was not a PG model) does anyone have the PG stock, can you comment on it? Any barrel type/length recommendations? The one I tried had been rebarreled with a Krieger barrel and was VERY accurate.I like SAGE EBR stocks... my MK14 CQB 16 type SEI in a M14ALCS/CV Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MajorJim Posted August 5, 2011 Report Share Posted August 5, 2011 beautiful rifle. As I attempt to educate myself about these rifles,I'm finding that there seem to be a lot of traditionalists out there that have very strong opinions with regards to what parts are appropriate to use when building one. It would appear that the old timers feel very protective about these guns. I've had people go so far as to tell me that it's sacrilegious to install one of them in anything other than a USGI stock.There are a few of those guys around. But they are becoming fewer and farther between. Until fairly recent times, the M14/M1A was a weapon without a war. Yes, they were used in the initial stages of Vietnam, but were phased out and replaced by the M16. While it may have been relegated to the scrap heap of warfare, the performance of the 7.62 cartridge versus the 5.56 was not lost on those that were able to choose their rifles. Special Ops needed something with more range and punch, and started pulling old M14's out of inventory. That did not go unnoticed by companies like Smith Enterprises, who worked with Crane Labs to put a new face on the M14. The ball got rolling, and pretty soon you had companies competing with Springfield Armory for M1A's. LRB is a perfect example - forged rather than cast receivers just like the "old" days. Op rods, bolts and trigger groups. The M14 was designed as a "battle rifle (whereas the M16 was designed as an "assault rifle"). It was not designed as a sniper platform. It is a rock 'em, sock 'em platform. If I recall correctly, the specs for battle rifles was around 4 MOA. Definitely not a sniper platform. But, when Spec Ops got into the mix, 4 MOA would not do. While the barrel set up on an M14 is not free floated, which is a definite disadvantage from the start, improvements and tweaks made by the likes of Smith and Crane labs, plus the old military National match armorers sharing their secrets of improving accuracy, now gives us a platform that can easily be worked to shoot 1 MOA or better. Bedding the action, unitizing the gas system, proper headspacing, etc. all get you pickups in accuracy.While there are a lot of new parts out there, they don't seem ot beat some of the original issue parts. The bolt is perhaps the best example of that. TRW bolts are still in high demand, which has sent prices way up. But they are kind of like a divorce - they cost so much because they are worth it!Stocks are one of the biggest areas of after-market improvement. Stocks like Sage and JAE eliminate the need to bed the stock - the receiver is bedded right into the stock with metal to metal. Guys who have these get some screaming accuracy out of an old warhouse. The biggest issue I see if the weight they add. Where the standard wood stock will bring the weight of the total rifle to the 9.5 pound range, some of these after market stocks will go 12 pounds and up. Just my personal advice here - stay away form the 16" SOCOM barrels. Accuracy and velocity suffer. The 18.5" scout barrel is great for a hunting set up. Of course, the 22" standard is going to improve on that even more. When you take a higher view of the M1A, it appears we have come full circle. Government contractors are now in the process of improving on the M16 - ditching the gas impingement set up for a piston in order to improve durability and decrease cleaning and barrel wear. And moving up in caliber from a 5.56 to a 7.62. The M14/M1a is a piston driven gas system in .308 caliber. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H2O MAN Posted August 5, 2011 Report Share Posted August 5, 2011 Just my personal advice here - stay away form the 16" SOCOM barrels. Accuracy and velocity suffer. The 18.5" scout barrel is great for a hunting set up. Of course, the 22" standard is going to improve on that even more. The 16.25" barrel Springfield Armory uses on the SOCOM is OK... the 16.25" CQB-16 barrel Smith Enterprise now offers is chambered for M118LR, it has a 1:10 ROT and it's accurate out to about 600 yards. SEI's 18.0" barrels are excellent out to around 800 yards and their 22.0" barrels reach well beyond 800 yards accurately. I own at least one of each length and my favorite barrel for general purpose use is SEI's medium heavy 18.0" M118LR barrel... I'm currently running one in a Rogue bullpup stock. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jgun Posted August 5, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 5, 2011 H2O man, I also like those Sage stocks. I see your posts on the Rouge, and impressive as it is, I "think" that I prefer a rifle with the magwell in front of the trigger due to the fact that I can make faster mag changes. For my first M1A I've decided to go with something built with accuracy as the primary goal. As Majorjim states above (and you of course already know) their getting sub MOA out of them these days, in fact the first one I ever shot was sub MOA for me. To that end, I have placed an order for a JAE Gen3 stock, and plan to go with a 22" barrel. For the next one, I thought I'd go with an 18" in a Sage or possibly the McCann. I thought it might be fun to see just how light I could build one of these. Do you have any personal experience with the McCann stock? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H2O MAN Posted August 6, 2011 Report Share Posted August 6, 2011 Jgun, I think you will be very happy with your choice.Sorry, but I don't have any personal experience with the McCann stock.I have read that it should help trim a few pounds... keep us up to date if you try one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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