Powder recs?

[Czgunner]

I've got some Saltech brass prepped to load, and a huge box of Nosler 155 CC bullets.

Rifle is lefty Stag 10 with 18" barrel and will be shot suppressed. In Wyoming, and it's been chilly.

What do you guys like to use for powder? I've got some Ramshot TAC and Varget in pretty good amount. Also have some other powders but only a pound or two: RL15, H4831, H4198, H322.

Any suggestions would be great.

Thanks!

[Czgunner]

Sorry, I forgot to mention it is a .308

[shooterrex]

I use Varget and BL-C(2).

That lets me load 5.56 & 308 with both powders.

[Czgunner]

I started a ladder of TAC. Hopefully it works out ok.

[Czgunner]

Hit the range today. Brisk but beautiful morning in WY.
This is what I was able to do at 100 yards. I'm not a pro shooter, just going off what the Army tried to teach me.
Saltech brass, CCI LRP, Ramshot TAC.
18" Stag 10L with YHM ULT can and 3-10 scope.
ProChrono DLX at 10 feet.
Hopefully the pics are OK.
Brass pic is lowest charge on bottom, working up.
Thanks ahead of time for looking and offering any suggestions.

[url=https://ibb.co/X2M0k2G][img]https://i.ibb.co/FxCZqxd/IMG-20230112-123619.jpg[/img][/url]
[url=https://ibb.co/7NprXBz][img]https://i.ibb.co/S7mVPHx/IMG-20230112-124114.jpg[/img][/url]

[Czgunner]

I lucked in to a pound of IMR 4061. I'm going to try that and see if I get better results.

[MikedaddyH]

On 1/11/2023 at 1:54 PM, Czgunner said:

I've got some Saltech brass prepped to load, and a huge box of Nosler 155 CC bullets.

Rifle is lefty Stag 10 with 18" barrel and will be shot suppressed. In Wyoming, and it's been chilly.

What do you guys like to use for powder? I've got some Ramshot TAC and Varget in pretty good amount. Also have some other powders but only a pound or two: RL15, H4831, H4198, H322.

Any suggestions would be great.

Thanks!

TAC , Varget and RL15 great for 308.

The H4198 and H322 I use on 6.8spc and 223/556 loadings. 

I haven't been able to ever pickup any H4831 in my area. My best advice is to buy multiple loading manuals.

[98Z5V]

8 hours ago, MikedaddyH said:

My best advice is to buy multiple loading manuals.

This is the truth...   ^^^

Use multiple references.

[Czgunner]

1 hour ago, 98Z5V said:

This is the truth...   ^^^

Use multiple references.

Yeah, I think I have them all!

[Czgunner]

I just finished loading a ladder of Varget and 4064 with the 155gr bullets.

Looks like this week we get a bunch of snow, so I won't be able to hit the range for a bit.

[98Z5V]

9 minutes ago, Czgunner said:

I just finished loading a ladder of Varget and 4064 with the 155gr bullets.

Looks like this week we get a bunch of snow, so I won't be able to hit the range for a bit.

Where you at on the Varget?  I used that initially with Hornady 150 FMJ-BTs, before I couldn't find it and switched to RL-15.  Just checking numbers, seeing how it compares to my load. 

[Czgunner]

44-46 in .5 grain increments.

I'm always a bit wary because none of the manuals develop data for gas guns, it's always bolt guns.

[98Z5V]

2 hours ago, Czgunner said:

44-46 in .5 grain increments.

I'm always a bit wary because none of the manuals develop data for gas guns, it's always bolt guns.

Nah, you're good - that range is good.  I run gas gun loads in two ways, for ladders.  0.3 grains apart for Large Frame cartridges, 0.2 grains apart for Small Frame cartridges.  Just because of the amount of powder, and the differences you'll see downrange when testing.

The only things I've ever developed 0.5 grains apart was .300 Win Mag and .338 Lapua Mag - we're talking 70 to 90 grains of powder in those two cartridges.  Shotcuts were necessary, just to find out what sucked the most, fastest.

So, anything in the AR15 frames get 0.2 grain ladders.  Anything that fits and shoots from the Aero M5s and LR-308s and AR-10s - I load those 0.3 grains apart.  Makes the results of your loads super-easy to see, on paper, at 100 yards.  You'll see it coming into a node, and hitting a node, pretty clearly. 

[98Z5V]

For the record - the only single load that I've ever tested down to the 0.1grain increment was my Mk262 clone load.  75gr Hornady HPBT, LC NATO brass, CCI 41 primer, 24.2 grains of RL-15.  2789.75 fps, averaged over 30 shots, through a Ballistic Advantage 18" Mk12 SPR stainless barrel, 1:8" twist, .223 Wylde chamber.

That load delivers. 

I've never ever put that level of load development into any other reload that I make.  Never had to.  Never wanted anything that perfect - and all the others have worked out perfectly, as well.  Just takes time...

Edited January 15, 2023 by 98Z5V

[Czgunner]

2 hours ago, 98Z5V said:

Nah, you're good - that range is good.  I run gas gun loads in two ways, for ladders.  0.3 grains apart for Large Frame cartridges, 0.2 grains apart for Small Frame cartridges.  Just because of the amount of powder, and the differences you'll see downrange when testing.

The only things I've ever developed 0.5 grains apart was .300 Win Mag and .338 Lapua Mag - we're talking 70 to 90 grains of powder in those two cartridges.  Shotcuts were necessary, just to find out what sucked the most, fastest.

So, anything in the AR15 frames get 0.2 grain ladders.  Anything that fits and shoots from the Aero M5s and LR-308s and AR-10s - I load those 0.3 grains apart.  Makes the results of your loads super-easy to see, on paper, at 100 yards.  You'll see it coming into a node, and hitting a node, pretty clearly. 

Thanks. I was told to use .5 grain steps on .308 and .2 on my 6.8. On my next ladder, I'll keep it tighter.

Hopefully I can get some good data from the chrony.

Edited January 15, 2023 by Czgunner

[98Z5V]

15 minutes ago, Czgunner said:

Thanks. I was told to use .5 grain steps on .308 and .2 on my 6.8. On my next ladder, I'll keep it tighter.

Hopefully I can get some good data from the chrony.

That will help - you'll see better results on paper, when you're testing.  .308 WIn doesn't need 0.5grain steps in load development - you'll miss something, steps in grain charge are way too large.  You're only talking about 45-ish grains for case capacity. You go 0.5 grains on ar  loads, you'll certainly miss something in the ladders/load charges, for accuracy.  There's just not enough case capacity to support jumps that large, without missing a node in there, somewhere.  For that reason, I run those big bastards 0.3, hit all the close ones where I didn't have pressure signs, then go back to 0.2 from there to finalize them.  Never had to run a large frame, bigger case load down to 0.1 grains to find the perfect load for a gun that I have, or a load that I've developed for them.

Again, I never put in the work that I did on the Mk262, going 0.1 off, just to find the perfect one.  That worked, though. And that's a small frame gun, 5.56 case, 75gr projectile, and making that load was my nemesis. Beating that factory military load was my nemesis. That was my goal, and it was obsessive. I managed it, but it took years, years in projectiles, powder, primers, money, time, shooting, barrel life...  It wasn't easy.

[DustBuster]

When you guys are doing your ladder, do you shoot like a group of 5 of one charge of powder, then go up “.3gr” for the next group of 5, the. Up again .3gr etc, looking for the best group?

 

or do you shout at one bullseye.. onne Of each charge increment , like 42, 42.3, 42.6, etc... Then analyze the elevation of the holes and where the deviation in elevation is least between a few of the shots, that’s where the node is?

ive been doing the Former and have never had much success.

[Czgunner]

10 hours ago, DustBuster said:

When you guys are doing your ladder, do you shoot like a group of 5 of one charge of powder, then go up “.3gr” for the next group of 5, the. Up again .3gr etc, looking for the best group?

 

or do you shout at one bullseye.. onne Of each charge increment , like 42, 42.3, 42.6, etc... Then analyze the elevation of the holes and where the deviation in elevation is least between a few of the shots, that’s where the node is?

ive been doing the Former and have never had much success.

I have only used the 5 rounds per charge method.

I just recently read of the second method: https://www.loaddevelopment.com/load-development-ladder-test-method/

I guess I don't understand how this is very accurate. It seems to assume that your rifle is absolutely perfect, and the shoot doesn't make mistakes? I like using the chronograph because it gives me data I can understand.