80% lowers

[will92104]

If a person builds a rifle with an 80% lower, how does that person prove that it was a self made rifle to get around LEOs for having an unregistered rifle?

[Matt.Cross]

If a person builds a rifle with an 80% lower, how does that person prove that it was a self made rifle to get around LEOs for having an unregistered rifle?

 

Building a rifle from an 80% lower still has to have approval from the BATFE, when you've done your paperwork correctly and gotten approval, your rifle is then effectively registered once it meets BATFE requirements as far as being serialized and all that.

[EasyEJL]

If a person builds a rifle with an 80% lower, how does that person prove that it was a self made rifle to get around LEOs for having an unregistered rifle?

you'll have to be specific as to what state you live in, that requires you to register a firearm. The ATF explicitly allows you to build firearms yourself so long as they are compliant with the NFA laws - no full auto or open bolt, barrel length at least ___, overall length at least ___, etc. There isn't even a requirement for a serial number on a self built firearm, although its suggested.

[will92104]

I live in communist california. As far as i know there is no paperwork required from the ATF to purchase an 80% lower. You just buy it, cash and carry, hollow it out and you have a useable lower to build a rifle or pistol. The manufacturer of the 80% lower needs to have a letter from the ATF stating that it is ok for them to be selling an 80% lower. I'm just wondering what the possible pitfalls are by building a rifle from an 80% lower that has been purchased from an authorized seller.

[Robocop1051]

Will,

Go to CalGuns and download the ATF and DOJ letters. Keep copies of those letters in an envelope inside your gun bag. They are helpful for quick reference in case there is a question.

While not required, consider engraving something for ID purposes on your rifle. Many choose a social security or DL number or even their name. It's especially helpfull if it were to get lost somehow.

[mineralman55]

Building a rifle from an 80% lower still has to have approval from the BATFE, when you've done your paperwork correctly and gotten approval, your rifle is then effectively registered once it meets BATFE requirements as far as being serialized and all that.

 

Don't think so. As long as you don't sell it or make a NFA type of weapon, you can make an 80% lower without any input from the feds. As far as the BATF is concerned, it's a paperweight.

[Matt.Cross]

Don't think so. As long as you don't sell it or make a NFA type of weapon, you can make an 80% lower without any input from the feds. As far as the BATF is concerned, it's a paperweight.

Is this true for every state? The reason I gave my answer as I did, was because the OP wanted to know about registration. There is no such thing for an unserialized firearm.

Edited August 26, 2013 by Matt.Cross

[EasyEJL]

Yeah, its definitely hard to tell exactly what California's laws are, as they are stricter than federal. it may be a requirement in CA to have a serial number and manufacturer engraving even on self - made firearms.

[jrtmasp]

I've done a fair bit of reading on the subject but am by no means an expert. From what I've gathered, and this could vary depending on your state, an 80% lower is deemed to be an equivalent of a paperweight (as was previously stated).

Robo made a very smart statement by recommending some sort of serial number. You will in fact need a serial number if you plan on selling it and thats the main reason for a serial number so the weapon has some basic level to be tracked for commercial sales.

If I were to do one, I would keep every single piece of paper to record the process. Pics might not be a bad idea as well, considering you can finish it in your garage with the right equipment. An envelope with the gun case containing copies will add an extra layer of "cover your ass." CA seems to be a popular state for those interested in 80% lowers. Also, there are a few companies that work with you and supposedly don't keep paper trails which has been said to exist for ATF purposes by a few 80 companies.

Edited August 26, 2013 by jrtmasp

[Matt.Cross]

I quote from the following page:

 

http://www.atf.gov/firearms/faq/firearms-technology.html#commercial-parts-assembly

 

 

We suggest that the manufacturer at least identify the firearm with a serial number as a safeguard in the event that the firearm is lost or stolen. Also, the firearm should be identified as required in 27 CFR 478.92 if it is sold or otherwise lawfully transferred in the future.

 

 

So if you've ever held a Concealed Carry Permit, your fingerprints are in the national database. If it were to ever be stolen, you might have a difficult time reclaiming it. If it is used in a crime and your fingerprints are found on an unserialized weapon, the doodoo would get mighty deep.

[jrtmasp]

^^^confirming the good idea portion... the crime involvement with a potentially stolen prior 80% will likely bring a strong helping of deeeeeeep doodoo lol. Nice point brother.

Another thing....if a person buys the drillpress template (you machinists will no doubt add to this) to finish one off, you are losing a bunch of money unless you do a whole lot of them. Those 80's are still pricey and they don't come coated.

Edited August 26, 2013 by jrtmasp

[will92104]

Thanks for all the replies. I think I'll have a folder of paperwork in my gun case when i get my lower finished and built.