Buffer spring advise

[mekks082]

Hello all, 

I am currently working on a ar-10/m5 build. The barrel I am running is a criterion 16" mid length with a adjustable gas block.

I purchased a Vltor A5 buffer and one of slashes XH buffers. I had plans on running one of the springco springs I have sitting around (red/orange/green).

After reading these forums everyone is advising the armalite ea1095. 

is it in my best interest to order one of those now? or will one of my springco work ok?

[shooterrex]

The orange will probably work w/slash's buffer. I'd try that first. The Armalite spring is designed for a slightly longer buffer tube.

[mekks082]

2 hours ago, shooterrex said:

The orange will probably work w/slash's buffer. I'd try that first. The Armalite spring is designed for a slightly longer buffer tube.

I was under the impression the A5 and the Armalite tubes where the same internal length - 7 5/8"

[unforgiven]

6 hours ago, mekks082 said:

I was under the impression the A5 and the Armalite tubes where the same internal length - 7 5/8"

Grab a tape brother ,you can't assume anything on this platform.

[Armed Eye Doc]

6 hours ago, mekks082 said:

I was under the impression the A5 and the Armalite tubes where the same internal length - 7 5/8"

 

7 minutes ago, unforgiven said:

Grab a tape brother ,you can't assume anything on this platform.

Measuring is the best way to know for sure, but I believe the A5 is the same as Armalite receiver extension.

[98Z5V]

20 hours ago, mekks082 said:

Vltor A5 buffer

VLTOR A5 buffers will not work in a larger-frame AR, and there's no other part that you can buy to make them work.  They're too long. 

You have 3 buffer-length choices for a .308 AR.  2.500" and 3.250" carbine buffers will work, but each with different receiver extensions.  It's specific to each one.  5.200" rifle buffers.  That's it, unless you throw RRA LAR-8 dimensions in there, with their longer BCG and shorter buffers, than those listed. 

You'll never, ever get the VLTOR A5 buffer to run in a .308AR.  Ever.

[mekks082]

3 minutes ago, 98Z5V said:

VLTOR A5 buffers will not work in a larger-frame AR, and there's no other part that you can buy to make them work.  They're too long. 

You have 3 buffer-length choices for a .308 AR.  2.500" and 3.250" carbine buffers will work, but each with different receiver extensions.  It's specific to each one.  5.200" rifle buffers.  That's it, unless you throw RRA LAR-8 dimensions in there, with their longer BCG and shorter buffers, than those listed. 

You'll never, ever get the VLTOR A5 buffer to run in a .308AR.  Ever.

I ment to type Vltor A5 Buffer Tube/RE. I will be running a 3.25" XH buffer from clint/slash.

Sorry about that.

Edited August 6, 2021 by mekks082
mistype

[98Z5V]

20 hours ago, mekks082 said:

 and one of slashes XH buffers. I had plans on running one of the springco springs I have sitting around (red/orange/green).

After reading these forums everyone is advising the armalite ea1095. 

is it in my best interest to order one of those now? or will one of my springco work ok?

Sprinco RED is designed for the Armalite AR-10 Carbine system.  The Orange is designed for 7.000" receiver extensions (AR15) running shorty 2.500" buffers.  Use the Sprinco RED in your build with slashes buffer, and the 7 5/8" internal depth receiver extension.  It'll work well.

The reason the EA1095 spring gets recommeded alot is (1) it never fails, and it's the same spring to use for Rifle and Carbine system, and (2) it should cost you about $8.  It's always made exactly the same, from the same materials, to the same dimensions, by the same company - there's no "Aftermarket" in there fucking it up. 

But, that Sprinco RED is a direct replacement for it - just more expensive. 

Edited August 6, 2021 by 98Z5V

[mekks082]

2 minutes ago, 98Z5V said:

Sprinco RED is designed for the Armalite AR-10 Carbine system.  The Orange is designed for 7.000" receiver extensions (AR15) running shorty 2.500" buffers.  Use the Sprinco RED in your build with slashes buffer, and the 7 5/8" internal depth receiver extension.  It'll work well.

The reason the EA1095 spring gets recommeded alot is (1) it never fails, and it's the same spring to use for Rifle and Carbine system, and (2) it should cost you about $8.  It's always made exactly the same, from the same materials, to the same dimensions, by the same company - there's no "Aftermarket" in there fucking it up. 

But, that Sprinco RED is a direct replacement for it - just more expensive. 

Awesome, just what I needed. Have two extra reds sitting around so. Thanks again.

[98Z5V]

7 minutes ago, mekks082 said:

Awesome, just what I needed. Have two extra reds sitting around so. Thanks again.

Perfect.     Now that we handed out the obligatory "free information," go hop in the Intro Section and tell us about yourself.

It's here (click it):

https://forum.308ar.com/forum/22-introductions/

[Albroswift]

9 hours ago, 98Z5V said:

VLTOR A5 buffers will not work in a larger-frame AR, and there's no other part that you can buy to make them work.  They're too long.

Looking at the specs they must be for small frame AR platform with AR-10 length carbine extension. Guess the question is why?

[98Z5V]

15 hours ago, Albroswift said:

Looking at the specs they must be for small frame AR platform with AR-10 length carbine extension. Guess the question is why?

Exactly why VLTOR developed the A5 Recoil System.  Exactly.  USMC.  The USMC will NOT give up the M16A4.  They DID need a solution to make it shorter overall, without losing the 20" barrel.

VLTOR developed the A5 Recoil System so it would exactly emulate the firing cycle/recoil impulse of the Rifle Recoil System on the M16A4.  - but with a collapsible stock.  It used the M16 rifle recoil spring, in the Armalite AR-10 receiver extension, with a special 4" buffer (exact is 3.995").  VLTOR makes a KILLIN' on the contract to the USMC... 

The only thing they really say about is this, on their buffer page:

https://www.vltor.com/shop/ar/buffer-components/vltor-a5-buffers-2/

Specifically developed on the request of the United States Marine Corps, ...

[98Z5V]

I run the A5 recoil System in the Grendels, the ARC, and the Valk.  Reason - those fat little cartridges have a little more Woo-Pow than the leeetle 5.56x45.  The A5 setup works really, really well.

But it's never gonna work in a .308AR - even though we've got that solved in this thread.  It'll come up again down the road, I'm positive.  Somebody will want to try it... 

Look at AR15 rifle buffers vs. .308AR rifle buffers.  5.900" vs. 5.200".    0.700" difference in length, because that's the difference in length of the two BCGs  - that have to operate inside the same rifle receiver extension.

Same deal with AR15 carbine extensions. Internal depth is 7.000" - both platforms need to operate inside there.  AR15 buffers are 3.250" and .308 AR buffers are 2.500" to run inside that extension.  Difference is 0.750".  Close, we're in the ballpark.

Armalite did it different in the beginning, ran (basically) AR15 carbine buffers weighted to 5.4 oz via replacing steel weights with tungsten weights...   and had to make that extension 7 5/8" internal depth, in order to use that 3.250" buffer length.  They did it. 

VLTOR had to find a buffer length to make (which could be heavier, but you could run a rifle recoil spring inside that extension), that would work inside 7 5/8".  3.995" was the magic answer - difference between the VLTOR A5 buffer, and AR15 buffer?  3.995" - 3.250"...   0.745"...

[Albroswift]

So there's the "Why"

Good explanation. Good numbers.