Quanto Mas?

[planeflyer21]

My buddy is looking to get a mid-length carbine, and is currently torn between .223 (which he wasn't impressed with in the Sand Box), a 6.8, and the .308 platforms.

What is the least he can pay for a reliable package in each of these calibers?  Also, how much could he do a basic M-forgery in each of those calibers if he built it himself?

Dude needs something!!

Jon

[Livnoutdoors6.8]

Whats he looking to do with it, is this going to be a hunting rig or a general blaser/ SHTF rig?

[planeflyer21]

His exact words are "Something I can clear a house with but still reach out to medium range."  Even though he was AAA they had him clearing houses...he knows it well.

Jon

[washguy]

My buddy is looking to get a mid-length carbine, and is currently torn between .223 (which he wasn't impressed with in the Sand Box), a 6.8, and the .308 platforms.

What is the least he can pay for a reliable package in each of these calibers?  Also, how much could he do a basic M-forgery in each of those calibers if he built it himself?

Dude needs something!!

Jon

Jon    My vote(putting on flamesuit) is a 6.8...ive got two of them and gathering parts for another. The 223 is a popgun... the 6.8 you can hunt with and defend yourself without breaking the bank on a 308. we just went to the range and Char was banging steel swingers at 300 yds with my 16" car 6.8....her 6.8 is an 18" but she was using the 16" and even liked it better! only thing is the 6.8 ammo is a lil pricey...bout 17 bucks a box.you can build a 6.8 for a darn good price...prolly around 900 bucks...using the good stuff. Of course we all know the 308 is the bomb! right?

go here for several diferent good priced uppers but dont no how well they shoot

http://palmettostatearmory.com/index.php/ar-15-05/complete-uppers/psa-16-6-8-spcii-mid-length-cmv-mp-upper-9077.html

me....! like ar perfromance barrels...freakin tackdrivers

the lil 16"

Wash

[Livnoutdoors6.8]

SOTA Arms is another place for budget uppers. I've been hearing good things about them.

[unforgiven]

<munch>

[Jgun]

As stated above, the 6.8 ammo is going to be more expensive. Is your friend planning to reload, that might offset the ammo situation a little. The other thing, 6.8 will be a small platform gun while .308 will be a large. You know that it will be less expensive building a small platform gun than a large, but over time, the ammo thing will negate that. Question is, does he want a small platform gun or large?  Also, I know the 6.8 will outperform the 300 BLK, especially if he want to shoot at 300yds regularly, but I'll bet the 300 would be cheaper to build and to feed than the 6.8 and i've pushed 125/135 gr .30 cal bullets to 2600 fps out of my 300 barrel, although I've not shot it past 200 yds.

[planeflyer21]

He just shot me a message asking if a Plum Crazy with DPMS 5.56 upper/1in9 twist, magpul grip, handrail, forward grip, flip up rear was worth $700.

Jon

[98Z5V]

He just shot me a message asking if a Plum Crazy with DPMS 5.56 upper/1in9 twist, magpul grip, handrail, forward grip, flip up rear was worth $700.

Jon

No.  Don't do the Plum Crazy lower.  Please trust me on that one...  <thumbsup>

Sometime tonight, I'll put together the price list on Project Pinky - that's a damn good 16" midlength rifle, and it didn't really cost that much.  Shoots great, accurate, and you can easily get out to 600 with the cartridge.  You probably wouldn't be making direct single-shot kills on medium game at that distance with it, but you could sure give someone a leak out to there.  ;D

[Livnoutdoors6.8]

I'be got a few hundred rounds of 556 and several hundred 6.8 on my Plum Crazy with no issues.  New frontier armory's polymer lower is getting good reviews too. Hard to beat a $110 complete lower!

[98Z5V]

It won't last forever, though... 

 

 

 

[MikedaddyH]

He just shot me a message asking if a Plum Crazy with DPMS 5.56 upper/1in9 twist, magpul grip, handrail, forward grip, flip up rear was worth $700.

Jon

Hmmmm ! Did I just do that.

It won't last forever, though... 

OUCH ! But they have a good warrenty replacement policy.

6.8spc ammo is pricey $18 to $22 a box. Reloading is a must,but brass is hard to find. That is the drawback.

[seasprite]

Hmmmm ! Did I just do that.

It won't last forever, though... 

OUCH ! But they have a good warrenty replacement policy.

6.8spc ammo is pricey $18 to $22 a box. Reloading is a must,but brass is hard to find. That is the drawback.

Seems to me with 6.8 ammo being about the same price as .308 I would choose .308 for the increased power and range over the 6.8. IMHO I would only choose the 6.8 if you wanted stay with AR15 frame and weight but wanted better capability than the 5.56.

[Jgun]

Wonder if those AKDEL 12ga shotguns, the ones that look like AR 15's, are made of the same type of polymer? If so I'm thinking that they might also have a short lifespan as compared to an aluminum or steel gun.

[MikedaddyH]

Saiga 12.... <thumbsup>

12 round AGP mag

American conversion parts are a must for compliancy.

Cool stock and ghost ring sights !

[Jgun]

First off, I don't wish to be rude and hijack this thread but I don't know how I could have linked the question about the material used in the Akdel shotgun if I had posted it in the shotgun section. I presently have a Saiga (I posted pics of it in the shotgun section a while ago) and think it's a great gun, but If someone came up with a steel or aluminum AR type 12 ga I'd certainly be interested,  I'd love to have a 12 ga that had the ergonomics of the AR. So far the nearest thing that I'm aware off is the AKDEL, but since it's polymer, I'm a little leary of it, hence my question. BTW, for the Saigas I like the Surefire mags, and I've got a red dot on mine because the box mag puts me in open division at the matches so I might as well have the optic, with my eyes it's a big help.

[MikedaddyH]

Sorry I jacked another thread, But I didn't think it through enough. When you mentioned the 12 ga shot gun the Saiga 12 just came to my mind. Too bad the AA12 isn't avaliable to the public. The AKDEL 12 is another gun I haven't seen or played with ,pictures dont count.

[washguy]

Jon    my lil honeyhole has these plus some others...complete 308 upperdpms 579bucks...that would get your friend well on his way...good price...you guys tell me? <dontknow>  Wash

http://www.outdoorgearbarn.com/p-22266-dpms-oracle-complete-upper-308-win-16-flat-top-black.aspx

[planeflyer21]

Dude at the range had both a Saiga and an AR 12 gauge.  Pretty impressive!

Thanks washguy!

Jon

[98Z5V]

I'm pretty sure the AKDAL shotgun is the same thing as the Atlantic Firearms shotgun - Atlantic were the first ones to bring it to our shores...  Is it the same one, both made in Turkey?

http://www.atlanticfirearms.com/storeproduct1000.aspx

[Jgun]

Yes thats it. I always call the gun by the company name because I can never remember the model name. I have seen that a number of the big Saiga builders, Tony Rumor of Tromix, Jim of Firebird Precision and Robert Right of R&R have all done work on modifying them for 3 gun. I saw that they had to mill the fixed polymer  butt stock off and thread the back to take a receiver extension so that they can use a collapsing stock. From what I've seen so far I've taken a wait and see attitude. I'd still prefer it if someone would just make a 12 ga AR. As far as I know the 1919 just looks like an AR it doesn't use an AR operating system.

[jeffreyC]

The Akdal uses an action based on the Remington 1100

I suspect due to the slower recoil impulse of a shotgun and heavier construction that the polymer receivers would last longer.

[Jgun]

In your opinion is the Rem 1100 operating system well executed by AKDEL in the 1919? Have you fired the gun? I have not seen them being used at any of the local matches, which may have more to do with the mags that are offered for them, than issues with the gun itself. I don't know of any company manufacturing 10/12 rd mags for the 1919 at the present time. As far as I know the high cap mags are all custom made right now.

[jeffreyC]

I have no personal experience with the Akdal.

I did research on it when I became aware of it.

I was looking at getting one but lack of aftermarket magazines and parts made me put that off.

There is some information and interest here;

http://forum.saiga-12.com/index.php?/forum/149-mka-1919/

I do not know if I will get one soon, not that I think they are bad, but I became interested in other things at this time.

[Jgun]

First off, I want to apologize again for taking this thread in a different direction, I should have started one in the shotgun section, but I seem to do a lot of free association when I read these threads/posts, and sometimes questions just pop into my head.

JeffreyC, good link there. it sounds like the heavy hitters in the comp shotgun game are all pretty much in agreement that the mag issue is whats holding the MKA 1919 back from taking off at the matches. Although I applaud what Jim's been doing with the guns and the mags, unless someone decides that there is enough money to be made, and tools up to manufacture hi cap mags in sufficient quantities that the price becomes more reasonable, I think that the Akdel gun isn't likely to catch on in a big way. And in this political climate I don't know if anyone wants to take the chance right now, to invest the time/money to  bring a viable product to market only to have it declared ilegal. I also think that when/if they start being widely used in competition, that will be when the weaknesses, if any, of the design will become apparent.