Dinan5e39 Posted July 2, 2013 Report Share Posted July 2, 2013 Hey All, I have a 18" bull barrel and as I understand it 1000 yards with a 180grn round is unlikely, but 800 yards should be no problem at all. 1- If this is incorrect please educate me. 2- would a 4-16x50 scope be good to 800 yards? What is your opinion on the proper power scope for 800 yards? LR-308 / 18" SASS Bull Barrel / 180grn match ammo Thanks, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
planeflyer21 Posted July 2, 2013 Report Share Posted July 2, 2013 These days you have great choices for long range scopes. I'm happy with 4-16x50mm but others like more magnification than that. Jon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLKSHEEP Posted July 2, 2013 Report Share Posted July 2, 2013 #1- 1000 yards is doable with practice & the right equipment. #2- Yes if it's a quality scope with enough internal elevation adjustment. You might need a scope mount with a 20 moa slant. #3- Ask 10 people and you'll get 10 different answers. I'd say yes 16x is enough power for 800 yards, if I planned on shooting that distance often then I would go with a 20-25x scope. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arcangel167 Posted July 2, 2013 Report Share Posted July 2, 2013 (edited) Dinan, I'm researching this too and will put my 2 cents in...So far I've looked at Millett, Vortex, NF, and Trijicon. I've physically been able to handle the Trijicon T22-2G, this is a great scope, 2.5-10x56 with nice glass and light weight. Even though I could get a smokin' deal on this scope ($850 vs $1056MSRP) I just felt something was missing...I would love to get the NF NXS 3.5-15x56 with the Velocity 1000 reticle. Price is a few hundred more then the Trijicon,($1449 and up) but I feel like you get alot more scope for the money. On the opposite end the Millett 6-25x56 LRS-1 is only about $479 but has alot of great features and would seem to be a great deal...so too the Vortex Viper 6.5-20x50PA with BDC reticle, it's an affordable scope ($459) with all the right stats and a great name behind it, but I'm reminded of the old adage "you get what you pay for". Not having had the chance to handle these scopes I'm not able to comment on the build quality, so don't misunderstand my previous comment. Millett and Vortex obviously make great scopes, I'm merely asking what separates these scopes from each other by so much monetarily when the numbers seem to favor the less expensive scopes? Glass? Quality of materials? Options? Hopefully the experienced members here can help us understand these questions and even answer a few for us... Regards, Paul Edited July 2, 2013 by arcangel167 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLKSHEEP Posted July 2, 2013 Report Share Posted July 2, 2013 (edited) First off I'm no expert but while I still have my 1st. amendment right I'll give my 2 cents worth. Yes the price usually reflects quality construction, materials & options. (you get what you pay for) Millet scopes are made in china that's how the keep the price low, they do offer lots of features for the $$ and lots of people swear by them. Personally I'll spend my $$ elsewhere. Specifications for Trijicon AccuPoint 2.5-10x56mm Tactical Scope w/ Fiber Optics & Tritium: Magnification: 2.5-10 Objective Size: 56 Bullet Drop Compensator: No Length (in): 13.80 Weight (oz): 22.10 Illumination source: Fiber Optics/Tritium Reticle Pattern: Triangle Day Reticle Color: Amber Night Reticle Color: Amber Calibration: N/A Bindon Aiming Concept: Y Eye Relief (in): 2.8 to 4.1 Exit Pupil (mm): 16.3 to 5.6 Field of View (?): 7.18 to 1.94 Field of View @ 100yrds (ft): 37.6 to 10.1 Adjustment @ 100 yds (clicks/in): 4 Tube Size: 30mm Mount: N/A Mount On/Comes With: N/A Housing Material: Aluminum Special Order: No Features of Trijicon AccuPoint 2.5-10x56 30mm Riflescope: Multi-layer coated lenses Scope body crafted of aircraft quality, hard anodized aluminum (1 or 2 piece tube ?) Matte black finish Water-resistant and nitrogen filled (not water proof) Manual brightness adjustment override Long eye relief Quick-focus eyepiece Fiber-optic collector with with non-distracting cover 1/4 MOA elevation and windage adjustments vs the MILDOT RETICLE (If you have a mil reticle it's best to have mil adjustments) The fiber optic reticle may have it's place and wire reticles also but the highest quality optics will have etched glass reticles. This scope doesn't have tall quick adjustment turrets and expensive features that go along with them. How much internal adjustment does it have? It's usually a bad sign when it's not stated. 2nd. focal plane scopes cost considerably less than 1st.focal plane. If you look closely you will notice most all mid to high end tactical scopes are freekin heavy....because their built tough. IMO this scope is way over priced at $800+ Night force has a excellent reputation, it's just quality through & through with pretty much has all the bells and whistles you could want. Vortex makes good to great quality optics, the model you mentioned is not one of the higher end ones,the 3.1" eye relief sucks! For a great scopes for under $1000 (that can compete with much higher$$scopes) take a look at the Vortex PST series & Weaver Tactical, compare their specs. to the TRIJICON and you will see they are far superior for the same $$ Edited July 2, 2013 by BLKSHEEP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bubbasks Posted July 2, 2013 Report Share Posted July 2, 2013 Obviously not one of the cool tactical scopes with a list of ooo's and ahhh's buttons and knobs but my 4x16 Steiner Predator Xtreme does a damn great job at those ranges. 20moa rail and plenty of internal adjustment and side focus and got mine for 9 bills.Before all the tall turrets and fancy features alot of things have been shot at great distances with plain jane scopes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
survivalshop Posted July 2, 2013 Report Share Posted July 2, 2013 Yes , you mostly get what ya pay for , but that doesn't mean the second or third best will not do the same job. And my Millet 4x16 x50 surprised me with its quality & precision & is built like a tank. I have many Nikon & Burris scopes that will do the same job as a $ 2K scope, but you are right , they may not be as clear or have all the bells & whistles , but do the job as needed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rsquared Posted July 2, 2013 Report Share Posted July 2, 2013 I won't say anything negative about the others since I don't have any of them. But, I do know, that with the NF scopes.....besides being nice glass....they're durable. They'll absorb being "bounced" and still be intact. That....and if you run out of ammo, you can pop it off the rifle and use it like a club and beat somebody with it. Then, when you get re-supplied, put it back on the rifle and still be able to utilize it. The picture that they (the company) show after a 7.62x39 round went through one....and the soldier simply duct-taped it (to keep the sand out of it) and continued on until he got back to base. Well.....that's pretty impressive. just my opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bubbasks Posted July 2, 2013 Report Share Posted July 2, 2013 Nf are amazing scopes if especially if you have the money for one. My all around favorite are nikon's. IMO the best bucks to glass ratio. The new monarchs and prostaffs seem brighter than the naked eye . Glass has come a long way. Speaking of tanks my utg accushot swat could be used to drive fenceposts lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLKSHEEP Posted July 3, 2013 Report Share Posted July 3, 2013 Y'all don't get me wrong, I wasn't trying to bash anyone's scope. Paul asked a question and I just tried to explain some of the differences, show examples and give some options. I have Nikons, Redfield, Leupold, Bushnell and a Weaver Tactical. Personally I would love to own a $3000 USO ,Premier, Steiner, etc... but I don't need one. I believe the best bang for the buck is with the mid priced scopes. To get the most value for your dollar you really have to compare the specifications closely! The 3.1" eye relief above is a pretty extreme example( I wouldn't want that on my 45/70) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cabinetman Posted July 3, 2013 Report Share Posted July 3, 2013 I'm going to highly recommend the Leatherwood. I've got one on my LR308b with an 18" bull barrel and shoot standard surplus 308 from it all day long. I've got this scope because it's tailored to the round you shoot and automatically calculates the elevation for you. You apply the windage. All you do is dial a knob for the distance you're shooting. I've tried it at 200 and 300 yards and found it to be really awesome to shoot over. I can't wait to try it at a 600 yard range this summer. It's even on sale! Rome http://www.opticsplanet.com/leatherwood-hilux-camputer-art-m1000-2-5-10x44-riflescope-art2510x44.html?gclid=CLqel-2lk7gCFRHhQgodNEcAtQ&ph=&adlens_source=google&ef_id=UXfOVAAABG70aA1r:20130703121147:s Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
planeflyer21 Posted July 3, 2013 Report Share Posted July 3, 2013 I have the Vortex with 3.1" eye relief. That's plenty for the RRA LAR-8. Nice clear and bright image, illuminated reticle with FFP. Can't beat it for $750. Jon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
survivalshop Posted July 3, 2013 Report Share Posted July 3, 2013 I like the Vortex line . I have one of there red/green dot sights on my POF,5.56 build & I simply like it big time . Could be because I never used one much before , but it is on the money , shot after shot . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLKSHEEP Posted July 4, 2013 Report Share Posted July 4, 2013 I have the Vortex with 3.1" eye relief. That's plenty for the RRA LAR-8. Nice clear and bright image, illuminated reticle with FFP. Can't beat it for $750. Jon Hmmm, that doesn't calculate in my little brain Jon. are you sure it's not 4.0" of eye relief? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rsquared Posted July 4, 2013 Report Share Posted July 4, 2013 I say.....as long as it works (for you)......go for it! just thinkin out loud Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLKSHEEP Posted July 4, 2013 Report Share Posted July 4, 2013 ^^^Agreed, I just don't want to put any stink on Vortex Scopes, they're one of my favorites! That 3.1" eye relief I mentioned above was for one of their budget scopes, not what Jon has. I'm guessing his is a Vortex Viper PST 4x16x50 which was on my very short list when I purchased my last scope so I'm very familiar with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
planeflyer21 Posted July 4, 2013 Report Share Posted July 4, 2013 It may be 4"...that's what the website says. Compared to other scopes I've had, it feels like miles. Jon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arcangel167 Posted July 4, 2013 Report Share Posted July 4, 2013 Thanks guys, I know you've answered my question, I hope Dinan got some good info too. Pretty certain I'm going to save my pennies for the NF... Regards, Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoFail Posted July 10, 2013 Report Share Posted July 10, 2013 SWFA SS 3-15x42 mil/mil $800. Very tough, good glass, side focus, love the reticle, quality, lifetime warrenty & great customer service. http://swfa.com/SWFA-SS-3-15x42-Tactical-Rifle-Scope-P62238.aspx http://8541tactical.com/2013/04/25/swfa-3-15x42mm-rifle-scope-review/ Does it have to be variable? I have SWFA 12x mil/mil and it is quite a good scope for $300. They have a 10x, 12, 16 & a 20x offered. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
survivalshop Posted July 11, 2013 Report Share Posted July 11, 2013 Damn, NoFail , I can't get past your avatar, did you say some thing ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BLKSHEEP Posted July 11, 2013 Report Share Posted July 11, 2013 SWFA SS 3-15x42 mil/mil $800. Very tough, good glass, side focus, love the reticle, quality, lifetime warrenty & great customer service.http://swfa.com/SWFA-SS-3-15x42-Tactical-Rifle-Scope-P62238.aspxhttp://8541tactical.com/2013/04/25/swfa-3-15x42mm-rifle-scope-review/ Does it have to be variable? I have SWFA 12x mil/mil and it is quite a good scope for $300. They have a 10x, 12, 16 & a 20x offered. Damn, that SS is a sweet scope at that $$, seems like they were double that last time I looked. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoFail Posted July 16, 2013 Report Share Posted July 16, 2013 It's their latest offering within last few months. BLKSHEEP, you may be thinking about the SS HD 5-20x50. That one is heavily reviewed and praised. About 1500$ for illuminated version. http://swfa.com/SWFA-SS-HD-5-20x50-Tactical-30mm-Riflescope-P51642.aspx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zebra644 Posted July 17, 2013 Report Share Posted July 17, 2013 (edited) Well , I am not an optics whiz but I can tell you a few things. First of all BUY ONCE CRY ONCE. Unless you own SWFA, Night Force, Leupold, U.S Optics, Premier, S&B, Ziess and the high end Vortex such as the HD's they wont hold value. I have owned in my journey a Millet, Burris,Trijicon, Vortex PST and finally a Night Force. Out of these the clearest and were the Burris, Trijicon and Night Force, in that order. There are various reasons why some scopes cost more than others. Sure the " name " has some to do with it. Its mainly these things. The quality of the glass. Some scope companies put huge bell's / end objectives to gather more light to make up for the lesser quality of the glass. Repeatibiliy , the scopes mechanical ability to return to absolute zero after dialing up and down on windage and elevation. First or second focal plane for accurate mil estimation using the scope as a rang finder and a little math. First focal plane scopes are accurate to range with through out the scopes power magnification and the cross hairs will change size ( to make it easier to describe ) depending on your magnification level. Second focal plane scopes are set to range at a specific power. They type of ret. you want to use, mil-dot, horus , ect. Also if the scope is has a lit or unlit ret. A side parallax adjustment. Also if the optic has a zero stop for the turrets. The Millet was one that flip a coin if you got a good one or a bad one I would not recommend. The Burris XTR was a good scope, nice glass but it had a BDC that didn't work with the barrel length and bullet weight / velocity I was using. So BEWARE of BDC great for a specific bullet weight / velocity if you don't use the same load your gonna have issues. The Trijicon great scope, but at night you can only see the green dot and no cross hairs. Absolutely crystal clear glass my windage turret broke called Trijicon got a repair tag had back within a week or two no questions asked. Never had a problem with it since, then I sold it lol. The Vortex Viper PST. Not bad the one I purchased and had shipped to me had trash in the ret. After I wrapped it in a towel and smacked it against a phone book not a problem. It uses shims to set zero stop, a good scope for the money. The glass however was ok but not as clear as my buddies Luepold. I had issues with eye relief on it also. For some reason I could just not get settled behind it. Vortex however has one hell of a no questions asked warranty. My Night Force, ahhh, I'll drink that kool aide all day long lol. The only things I don't like about it is the eyepiece and the magnification ring all rotate and is a pain in the ass when you are using flip scope covers. The other is the glass itself is Japanese, but damn its clear, the rest of the scope is USA. The reasons I went Night Force over Leupold is the warranty. Leupold only warranties their electronics for 5 years. Night Force if you broke it, damn it must have been good send it in. Also the Night Force can be modified, you can have it sent back in to have the ret. changed, turrets ect. They can tell you the price of everything before hand. Also the scope tube is modular meaning, Lord forbid some how some way the bell of the scope gets FUBAR'd or a round goes though the tube by the eye piece, send it in. The tubes are threaded into the turret base / housing and they can unscrew the damaged part, screw on a new one, put the scope through its paces and QC and send it back. I can literally use my Night Force as a carry handle on my AR-10 SASS. SWFA I have seen a lot of them GREAT scopes too. Nice glass and SWFA customer service is also top notch and the guys at SWFA.com will walk you though with any questions you may have Me personally I can afford and cant honestly justify spending coin on USO / Premiere and S&B . I hope maybe through my experience this may help someone out. Also if I wrote something incorrect please advise me so I to can learn a little more. Edited July 17, 2013 by Zebra644 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unforgiven Posted July 17, 2013 Report Share Posted July 17, 2013 Well written brother,thank you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
washguy Posted July 17, 2013 Report Share Posted July 17, 2013 Hi Dinan I thought that i needed 8x32 nikon scopes for 500 but I bought a nikon m-308 and im very impressed with it out to 500...thats all we got around here for a range.... of course ive got bionic implants in both eyes...amazing stuff they can do for an farts eyes these days :)) Wash Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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