98Z5V

Just went through this over the weekend, with the night shoots to 450 yards. Not "low-light" shoots - night shoots, when it's DARK. Not only is an illum reticle almost mandatory (unless you're shooting in a full moon, no cloud cover, and the moon is behind you), the amount of illum on the lowest setting is very, very important for night shooting. If your "Number 1" is bright as hell, and you can't turn it down from there, then it's worthless for shooting at night. I had a scope that I had to turn to (between) 2 and 3 for shooting that distance, at midnight. I tried both... It worked wonderfully for that.

Whatever their response is, it'll be interesting to see - please post it. The bottom line is this - the gas tube ends at the center of the cam pin cutout in the upper receiver - look at ANY AR15, and that's what you'll find, because there's apublished pattern for that, and it's the Colt Technical Data Package (TDP) from military contracts. It goes way deeper than that, though, back to the development of the system, back to Armalite There are some larger-frame manufacturers that think this doesn't matter. Large Frame has two gas systems - DPMS-based, which uses AR15 gas tubes, and gas tube lengths (and gas port locations). Armalite AR-10-based, which use gas tubes developed and made for the larger height-over-bore of a .308, over the AR15 - and the gas tubes are longer, with a gas port in a different location. That comes from the inventor of the rifle, Eugene Stoner. He developed that, and it was first, before the AR15. On average,AR-10 gas tubes are 3/16" longer than AR15 gas tubes, as well as having different bends in them, for the height-over-bore differences. These days, there are barrel manufacturers that think they'll just make a gas port that's half way in between AR15 specs, and the Armalite AR-10 dimensions - then, you as the user, can buy whatever gas tube that hits your door, and it'll work for most of the people, with most of the ammo, most of the time. It's easy to NOT stick with a spec, either AR15 or AR-10, and it works most of the time. Gas TIMING is what's affected most with this "issue of port location." But, it's no big deal, according to the "halfway people." You should have gas pressure to the bolt carrier gas key until that gas key clears the mid-point of that cam pin cutout. At that point, the excess gas vents, when the gas key separates from the end of the gas tube. You run a short gas tube, and you stop that gas pressure before it was intended to be stopped, by the designer of the platform. Now, combine a buffer that's too light, a spring that everybody makes to NO SPEC, and manufacturer off the street that thought they'd jump in this Large Frame Game, you get a receiver extension that's 0.100" too long in internal depth... and let's top that off with a gas port that's to small... You have a gun that doesn't run - due to all that stuff combined. It will suck, on any ammo. I've geeked out on recoil systems for these things for a long time. Done the same with gas system specs (or lack of specs), and this "halfway" gas port location, which is bullshiit. We measure hammer lock-time in milliseconds. It matters, for accuracy. And there are manufacturers out there that are ignoring proper gas system length - which affects the entire bolt-unlocking and extraction process BY MILLISECONDS... and it's no big deal... they say... It makes a difference.

@painterman do you reload any ammo? If you do, give the Hornady GMX, SST, or ELD-X projectiles a try. They are all hunting projectiles, and all very good. You load up something in the 165~175 range, and they'll all perform great for you, in hunting. Sierra 165gr Game Kings are also very accurate, and specific hunting projectiles. 90gr Sierra Game Kings are by far the most accurate projectiles that I've found, so far, for my 25/45 Sharps. 90gr Hornady GMX is the next test on loads for that gun.

^^^ What happened to that gun, the issue, is a Failure to Eject from the rifle, because of a Failure to Extract. The extraction is the primary problem, because the extractor let go of the casing too early - because of a weak extractor spring. The secondary issue of the extractor letting go (due to the weak spring) was that the casing wouldn't get out of the gun- Failure to Eject.

I'm no genius, but I watch the stuff going on with all these rifles, regardless of brand. For your FTE issues, are the casings coming out of the chamber? Are they getting out of the rifle? FTE can be "Failure to Extract" and also "Failure to Eject." This right here is REALLY INTERESTING, and it just happened recently - I've never seen this one before, but the correction for it is in here - It's definitely worth looking into:

The Long Distance side was excellent, and sucked at the same time. It was a very good day, overall, but we had hellish wind. The only thing I took over there was the .260 Rem. The brake on this gun is the VG6 6.5 Gamma. That brake just plain works, and I could watch every impact (or miss) on all the shots, right through the scope. It works very, very well. I was the only one to poke the 500 yard target. First round hit at 2 3/4 mil holdover (no dialing), saw what I got, and moved on. I'll take this all day long. There were several people shooting at the 842 this time - that's just where it ended up in the dirt, distance-wise, when we planted it on this one. I crushed that thing right out of the gate, with 6.5 mils of drop. Shocked the hell out of me. There weren't alot of guys hitting the 1010 yard target, but I was getting that thing with 9.0 mils of dialing. The hits were very impressive. This was mostly .260 Rem and 6.5 Creedmoor contact, here, and there's not a bad shot on this target - and not every shot did hit the target, either. It was a tough day on it. There was anywhere between 1.5~2.5 mils of wind hold to hit this guy - it was changing all the time. That's a 10mph wind minimum, right there, at 1.7 mils, for this load.

I'll buy that mount from you - I used one of them on the 12.5" Grendel, and I like it. Just lemme know what you had to pay for it, and I'll pay for shipping from you to me, too.

The brake on this gun is the VG6 6.5 Gamma. That brake just plain works, and I could watch every impact (or miss) on all the shots, right through the scope. It works very, very well. My final load from my Round 2 of load development was 43.0gr of RL-22, CCI200 primer, Hornady 308 Match brass resized to .260 Rem, necks turned with KM Shooting Products 6.5 neck turning tools, 2.785" loaded OAL, 2650fps out of the WC 20" rifle gas Tactical Hunter barrel. I was the onlyone to poke the 500 yard target. First round hit at 2 3/4 mil holdover (no dialing), saw what I got, and moved on. I'll take this all day long. There were several people shooting at the 842 this time - that's just where it ended up in the dirt, when we planted it on this one. I crushed that thing right out of the gate, with 6.5 mils of drop. Shocked the hell out of me. There weren't alot of guys hitting the 1010 yard target, but I was getting that thing with 9.0 mils of dialing. The hits were very impressive. This was mostly .260 Rem and 6.5 Creedmoor contact, here, and there's not a bad shot on this target - and not every shot did hit the target, either. It was a tough day on it. There was anywhere between 1.5~2.5 mils of wind hold to hit this guy - it was changing all the time. That's a 10mph wind minimum, right there, at 1.7 mils.

That's some artwork, right there. Beautiful work. I had the chance to chrono this load - 2650 fps average - much better than I thought. It proved it, too, out there this weekend. 6.5mils of drop at the 845 yard target, and just drilling it... I had hits on 1010 yards with 9.0 mils of drop, and we had some very, very weird wind going on, with gusts to 20mph. This chart tells me I should be 8.5 mils of drop, and I'll try that on a day that's less crazy with the wind. If this is accurate, I'll be supersonic to 1500 yards with 17.2 mils of drop. That's unreal.

They'll tell you that it's good for most of the people with most of the ammo most of the time. Same story we hear from everyone that used that ignorant gasport location.

It's all over the site here, with pics from people, even. I have two WC barrels, and they're great. Their decision on gas port location isn't the best, though.

^^^ That 9 was DIRTY. If you stuck your finger in there, you wouldn't get it back - he tried to get me to do it, but I wasn't gonna risk it...

Try the National Match, and you'll see the difference pretty quickly.

Camp location is always the same, every shoot. Here's camp, from the hill, in one of the first pics I posted above...

Doc, that's fantastic! I love it when a plan comes together... Fine shooting, my man.

Here's what the 370 looked like:

It wasn't an easy walk, but it wasn't a killer, either. That spot is perfect, too, with that ledge right there on the edge. The only gun I took to the distance side was the .260. It didn't disappoint me at all. The one I took up the hill for angles was the 16" Grendel Mod H. Perfect for that situation. You would have loved it, Ron - it was a great time up there. Mike and that damn 10mm, though... We started right away with the jokes, too - "You're gonna hit everything BUT the target with that damn thing!" I ended up shooting a mag at a target that was 214 effective yards, 20 degrees down. I hit it on the last round. Of course, them @Matt.Cross has to shoot a mag and get TWO hits... Bastard... That last pic above is Matt shooting the pistol.

^^^ Mike corked a 376 yard target at 10 degrees down, first shot. .300 WSM.

Nope, but this is excellent information.

Wrapping up - got everything back to the compound, and we're downloading now. Gonna be a minute before I get any pics up. Short version: the .260 is badfukkinass. Flat shooting as all hell, chrono states 2650fps on the 147gr projos. 6.5 mils of drop at the 845, 9.0 mils of drop an a thousand. Unreal. High Angle is the shiit. I've got some great pics of that stuff...

It's beginning - just got Matt here, and it's started!...

^^^ CBD is working...

87.

That PVS-14 is a pound-ish, by itself. I rocked one of those things for years, behind an Aimpoint, on a 5.56 gun. It's worth the weight, once the sun goes down...