survivalshop

I don't know much about Armilite mags other than as mentioned they are a M14 type ,but I have photo's of the Pmag ,CProducts & DPMS mags disassembled & others . They are all a little different , except for the 308 Pmag , its got a very long spring, not sure if anything but the spring can be inter changed , except the Pmag, nothing will fit the others .I'll see if I can post them again. Left to right ,Mag Tec 20rd. 308 , CProd, 20rd 308 , DPMS 19rd. 308 & Pmag 20 rd. 308

From the sight about the process, "During these processes, nitrogen, carbon, and small amounts of oxygen are diffused into the surface of the steel, creating an epsilon iron nitride layer (e - FexN)." Sure sounds like a coating . This is new stuff to me & most , I'm sure .I'm not trying to cut it down or any thing like that ,just trying see what its about. It sounds good ,but too new yet & not enough imput from years of testing on barrels . It is the same as the my first post , where is a comparison of different barrels & now types ? Its still a " my barrel is better than yours " comparison ,sorry but it fits. I have two builds ready for barrels & I'm interested in what this process has to offer , pro's & con's . I'm going to check out the bench rest shooters sight for info also.

Nice . I want one .

Photo's as you build . Sure is nice of DPMS to make a lower cost gas block for the SASS . That was sarcasm!

Now we know why SI's parts are taking so long to catch up , aah Robocop1051 ;)

One would think that the way the barrel was made , would also count on how good any internal finish was put on it . Meaning if its got rough rifling & miss shaped lands , its going to have them even after any coating . Any imperfection in a Chrome lined barrel can be lapped out as in the case of Fulton Armory's match grade chrome lined barrels . The milspec barrels that are made for most of our military , this is not done & its really not needed. The lumps flatten out with use ,but they are not made for match rifles ether . Bluing is not a coating , it penetrates the metal some what ,but its not meant for rifling , its a rust prevention system & even though its a very old system , it does a good job if kept clean & oiled . I like the idea of this coating & will read up on it , But as I said , I mostly use Stainless Steel barrels , so corrosion is not on my preventive list . Hell when I clean my barrels ,I don't use any oil , the bullet jacket is a bearing surface & none is needed . It would just burn off the first couple of shots & leave more residue to foul the action & bbl. & more to clean up. I want to see you guys results with already broken in barrels that are coated this way to see how this Melonite coating works out . One more note , Just because a bunch of manufacturers use a product or system does not necessarily mean its the best , could just mean cheaper or easy-er or both for manufacturing . Coatings have come a long way through the years .

The internal dia. of all receiver extensions are the same ,be it commercial or milspec. The buffers are all the same dia. , so will fit any receiver extension . Are you building a 308 platform rifle ? There are those that use 5.56 buffers for 308 rifles , but the Armilite receiver extensions are ,I think, longer then M16/AR15 /DPMS 308 type extensions ( some one correct me if its the other way around ) I have Superior Shooting systems springs for my 308's & they work with both collapsible or std stock systems. If you want to use the Armilite system , get an Armilite receiver extension also & you can use the components you describe. I use 308 designated components in my 308's & I don't have to tweak a thing. Same receiver extensions as an M16/AR 15, be it commercial or Mil spec. I think those $ 100 buffers are over rated, but may be needed if not using matched components.

I think the Cyro treatment is to relieve the stress on parts from manufacturing. I guess if you can rearrange the molecules of metal with high heat ,maybe sub freezing it may do the same .

Well the last three rifles I built were test fired with out any muzzle device on them at all & then a brake was added , I can tell you , to me ,they work in varring degrees. The PRI on my 20" 308 , works real well . The Vltor vt301 made my 16" 308 less of a blaster to those in line next to me & some say made it quiet compared to no muzzle device ( it was loud )I got it more for flash suppression than a brake ,but they say its both . The Smith Enterprises is on my 300BLK & also works very well .

Kahr PM 45 w/extra mag, 230 gr. FMJ.

I have one too & was in time for the extra mags & holder . Very good shooter .

I think they make them for bench rest shooters or some thing like that. I also hand prime all my brass . I like to feel the primer seat , in your case not seat or go in at all . Glad you are OK .

I do not have or will I get a machine rest to test barrels , good idea ,but hardly worth the expense when I'm sure the info is out there from another source. Jgun, you test will be interesting . That Melonite coating sounds more like a bluing process, but much harder , it will be interesting to see the results. The problems I see with most tests not being conducted in a lab setting is the ability to test exactly the same between the test samples . Not saying your test will not be valid ,but to get the proper results , all paramiters have to be exact , to have proper compared results . I can see this post could just keep going ,because in a way , we could never know the answer . Being no two barrels , even from the same manufacturer , may not be the same , it would probably come down to a group of manufacturers that have a reputation of having good barrels . I was just contemplating what barrel manufacturer to use on the next two builds I have coming up a 5.56 & 7.62 , I am pleased with the two Kreiger barrels I have for my 7.62"s may go with another manufacturer just to see if there is a difference . I have a pre-ban .223 Olympic arms build ,with there S/S match 24" HB ,1-10 twist & it is a shooter ,still. Back then they were one of the few that made them , we are talking over twenty five years ago . I have no idea how many rds. were put through this rifle ,because I never counted , but she still goes to the range ,never had a scope , A2 sights & the first type of free float hand guard on AR's. This rifle impresses all who shoot her .

I noticed some thing odd about this lower receiver group , it doesn't have the " K " after the ser. #. Ya think it was a complete rifle once ? This is a unfired lower , I will take some photo's today & post them.

If you can't scan it , I will .

That is a nice hog ,but I think they played a little camera trickery with it to make it look larger compared to the person in it . Look how far back he is from the hog.

I agree with the surpressed difference between the two gas systems ,but you will find that you substitute one cleaning procedure for another . The piston systems are not cleaner , your just putting the propellant fouling from one place to another . Granted its not in the BCG area ,but its some where. If you have not shot a piston system enough to foul it , I can tell you it is some times a lot of fun disassembling it when prolonged firing is required . Then if you add corrosive ammo & that's where it gets real fun . Get the hammer & punch out . Lets face it , both systems have there pro's & con's .

The light weight CC frame may not be able to take the constant punishment of the 10MM. , unless you intend to use light loads in it , but hay , ya never know . <munch>

The problem I see with most of the info out there about barrels except for what was in tripledeuce's post , (with first hand experience) , is just ,how can I say , vendor hype . They want to sell a product & say its "faster, stronger" than other barrels . They are showing you there data , no independent confirmation about any of it . I'm not saying there is no truth to it ,just its info from some one who wants to sell there product , if ya know what I mean . What about the hammer forged barrels , I have also heard a lot of hype about them , but the reason for this post is I'm looking for real data or first hand experience with the different manufacturers products and any comparisons.

Where are you getting Melonite coated at ? What I mean & would like to see is a comparison of which barrel manufactures have or sell the best blanks/barrels , is there such a thing ,has any one ,maybe Sniper unit armorers ? I have no doubts about the chamber forcing cone erosion . It also has to do with how hot the load you use., type of powder & so on . I have always thought that a good name brand made barrel will get the most round counts , but is a higher dollar manufactured , really worth the extra cost when you are just a casual shooter . We all know we want to shoot the best we can every time we are at the range , but is that high dollar barrel really shoot that much better & have a longer service life . Almost all the barrels I use are match grade .

I know we talk a lot about what barrel to put on a rifle ,but is there that much difference in say a $ 500 range to a $ 300 range as far as real documented accuracy ? Lets say you put a ( just a comparison ) Noveske vs a Kreiger Criterion . Is it really going to out last & out shoot the less expensive barrel ? I don't mean the seat of the pants ,my rifle shoots better than so & so's , I mean a documented comparison between a high priced barrel & ,not so high priced ? Is it really worth it the extra cost ? If I could get a barrel that shoots that good , will that accuracy , if really better, stay that way , compared to the lower priced barrel ? Any links you know that really compare manufacturers barrels .

Well , I like POF stuff & know nothing about the ACR , so I'm biased.

Are you talking about the Vender's listed here or vender's in general ? Brownell's for one ,Armilite ,JP's, Troy & the list can go on. Just go to one of the web sights & there should be a place to order a catalog or down load it .

As long as you keep in mind that a light 308 is going to punish your shoulder more , even with a brake on the bbl.. If you want a light barrel , forget the flutes , they are cut into HB to lighten them up & try to keep the stiffness needed to have a tighter grouping barrel , you can get a lighter barrel with out the flutes.

Yes , it must be stress relieved to do it correctly & there is Cryogenic treatment also. Most are fluted before bore / rifling is done.