S&W Eliminated From Mod Pistol Testing

[planeflyer21]

Looks like S&W has been eliminated from the U.S. Army's modular pistol search:

http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2016/09/24/breaking-smith-wesson-eliminated-us-armys-modular-handgun-system/

SIG was cast out in the FBI's handgun search, for incompatibility with frangible ammo.

Edited September 25, 2016 by planeflyer21

[blue109]

Not a Glock fanboy, and don't even own one....but I'd guess the only reason anyone ever beats Glock in these shakedowns is because they supply more hookers and blow to the decision makers.

[survivalshop]

  They probably knew their choice before the trials started !

[survivalshop]

  So this means that we will have another Military weapon made by another Country . Not that I think S&W is a superior firearm , but surely their has to be a US company that can fit the bill , WTF 

[RRS]

I went to the dark side 7 years ago, Glocks are just ideal tools for work, they're cheap, run reliably under all conditions, parts galore, easy to maintain, etc etc... its a no brainer.

Americans make plenty of money off Glocks, no reason to wish they were made here, or a US company owned them.

Just MHO.

[ARTrooper]

I carry a glock at work... hate the damn thing. it's like shooting a brick. it's uncomfortable and the angle of the grip doesn't feel right to me. yes RRS you have some good points why glocks are good, but comfort helps with shooting well. I have to use hundreds of rounds a month to stay proficient with my glock, but give me my cz, 1911, sig, or h&k and I need no warm up even after months of not shooting them.

and as for run reliably under all conditions, well I have seen many malfunctions with them, some being slack wrist, but others were just wtf moments. even something as simple as the slide not locking back when it should.

easy to maintain... well my other pistols I think are just as easy to maintain.

parts are not hard to find these days for most of the big companies either.

and many other guns come at reasonable prices that is not that far off from glocks, even h&k vp40 or sig p320.

the thing about glocks is you either hate them or you love them, so far a lot more people I know hate them and most of the others would just simply rather carry something else.

[shepp]

15 minutes ago, RRS said:

I went to the dark side 7 years ago, Glocks are just ideal tools for work, they're cheap, run reliably under all conditions, parts galore, easy to maintain, etc etc... its a no brainer.

Americans make plenty of money off Glocks, no reason to wish they were made here, or a US company owned them.

Just MHO.

 

4 minutes ago, ARTrooper said:

I carry a glock at work... hate the damn thing. it's like shooting a brick. it's uncomfortable and the angle of the grip doesn't feel right to me. yes RRS you have some good points why glocks are good, but comfort helps with shooting well. I have to use hundreds of rounds a month to stay proficient with my glock, but give me my cz, 1911, sig, or h&k and I need no warm up even after months of not shooting them.

and as for run reliably under all conditions, well I have seen many malfunctions with them, some being slack wrist, but others were just wtf moments. even something as simple as the slide not locking back when it should.

easy to maintain... well my other pistols I think are just as easy to maintain.

parts are not hard to find these days for most of the big companies either.

and many other guns come at reasonable prices that is not that far off from glocks, even h&k vp40 or sig p320.

the thing about glocks is you either hate them or you love them, so far a lot more people I know hate them and most of the others would just simply rather carry something else.

Best advice I ever got when I asked a guy what hand gun I should buy: "whatever one feels best in your hand"

[ARTrooper]

exactly, if it doesn't feel good then you wont shoot it as well as you would something that feels like a part of your hand.

[Sisco]

5 minutes ago, shepp said:

 

Best advice I ever got when I asked a guy what hand gun I should buy: "whatever one feels best in your hand"

 

There you go. After years of wonder 9's, Sigs and FN's in 9 mm .40 and .45 acp. I find myself back to packing a 40 year old S and W Model 28 revolver in .357 magnum. Still feels the best and hits any thing I want within 50 yards. Couldn't do that with any of the others.

[ARTrooper]

anyone know anything about the beretta apx? I haven't gotten to play with it. one of my pistols is the beretta px4 storm though and I would of sold it a long time ago if my wife didn't want it for herself. I think beretta dropped the ball on that one so hopefully they have redeemed themselves with the apx.

[beantown]

24 minutes ago, ARTrooper said:

anyone know anything about the beretta apx? I haven't gotten to play with it. one of my pistols is the beretta px4 storm though and I would of sold it a long time ago if my wife didn't want it for herself. I think beretta dropped the ball on that one so hopefully they have redeemed themselves with the apx.

I haven't seen an APX yet, and i haven't run across a review of it either. And from what I have read the APX and the 320 are the only two that meet the whole modularity requirements. That's not to say that ole Gaston's boys haven't kicked out something that does meet the requirements. And no one knows what got S&W eliminated either. I doubt we will ever hear why.

I'm like you, I cannot shoot a Glock for the life of me. The grip angle makes my natural point of aim hit WAY low. I did shoot the VP40 a couple of weeks ago. My HK P2000SK .40S&W is going to have a new stable mate shortly. My H&K fits my hand perfect, it feels like an extension of my arm. I tell people the same thing as Shepp said. I don't care who makes it, if it fits your hand and you shoot it well, run with it.

JMHO,

Shane

[survivalshop]

  S&W 's issue may be like my last two I bought , they were recalled a couple weeks after I bought them . No more for me . 

  I agree , its all about how comfortable you are with a Hand Gun , if its uncomfortable , it will show in your shooting capabilities . I know the XDM's are not made in the USA , but I have a few of them & all feel good in my hand . I'm also a 1911 man , they are just natural feeling , with some minor adjustments in grip & Main Spring housing, for me .

  I just don't understand why the USA can't have a Hand Gun that doesn't fit the Military's requirements . I believe its not that big of challenge , of course ,if its fixed , that can not be overcomed , with any Pistol.

8 hours ago, Sisco said:

 

There you go. After years of wonder 9's, Sigs and FN's in 9 mm .40 and .45 acp. I find myself back to packing a 40 year old S and W Model 28 revolver in .357 magnum. Still feels the best and hits any thing I want within 50 yards. Couldn't do that with any of the others.

 Damn Sisco , that N frame is a big hunk of metal to be packing .

Edited September 29, 2016 by survivalshop

[Sisco]

13 hours ago, survivalshop said:

  S&W 's issue may be like my last two I bought , they were recalled a couple weeks after I bought them . No more for me . 

  I agree , its all about how comfortable you are with a Hand Gun , if its uncomfortable , it will show in your shooting capabilities . I know the XDM's are not made in the USA , but I have a few of them & all feel good in my hand . I'm also a 1911 man , they are just natural feeling , with some minor adjustments in grip & Main Spring housing, for me .

  I just don't understand why the USA can't have a Hand Gun that doesn't fit the Military's requirements . I believe its not that big of challenge , of course ,if its fixed , that can not be overcomed , with any Pistol.

 Damn Sisco , that N frame is a big hunk of metal to be packing .

I like to wear loose clothing.

[RRS]

On 9/28/2016 at 7:12 PM, ARTrooper said:

I carry a glock at work... hate the damn thing. it's like shooting a brick. it's uncomfortable and the angle of the grip doesn't feel right to me. yes RRS you have some good points why glocks are good, but comfort helps with shooting well. I have to use hundreds of rounds a month to stay proficient with my glock, but give me my cz, 1911, sig, or h&k and I need no warm up even after months of not shooting them.

and as for run reliably under all conditions, well I have seen many malfunctions with them, some being slack wrist, but others were just wtf moments. even something as simple as the slide not locking back when it should.

easy to maintain... well my other pistols I think are just as easy to maintain.

parts are not hard to find these days for most of the big companies either.

and many other guns come at reasonable prices that is not that far off from glocks, even h&k vp40 or sig p320.

the thing about glocks is you either hate them or you love them, so far a lot more people I know hate them and most of the others would just simply rather carry something else.

Good points, but...meh?

I like the way my Glocks feel believe it or not, it took some training and they are not the natural point angle for me as say my 1911's, but its a subjective thing right, and so for me its a tool, and just like my gransfors axes or Makita drills, they're the best option for what tool they are IMO, and I learn to work with them, and work with them well.

There is hardly a question but that the Glock is one of, if not the single most durable pistols on the planet, they have endured excruciating torture tests and out performed all the usual suspects in the process, that is simple fact, not a subjective observation.

There may indeed be other simple pistol platforms out there that are also easy to maintain, ie., striker fired copycats, etc., but none that are more reliable or easier to maintain.

As for parts for Glocks, they are everywhere, and there is probably more factory and/or after market parts for Glocks out there than any other pistol in the world less perhaps the 1911.

I own and enjoy HK's, am not a Sig fan particularly, although they are fine handguns, but all in all its just damn hard to beat the price of a Glock and still get equitable form, function, and aforementioned appeal that the Glock offers.

I know there are haters, plenty of them, but rest assured sale figures confirm the scales are tilted far and away in the Glock fans favor. 

Anyway, to each their own, I am one guy, but I own 4 of them, and there will be more to come... LOL.

Here's to us all enjoying shooting whatever platform one chooses to trust with defending your life, I do. ;-)

 

[jtallen83]

Glock as most durable???? I'm not sure they have been around long enough to say that. When one takes the same abuse and still shoots like the 45 year old 1911 I was issued in the service I'll consider it, keep in mind that 1911 was possibly  used in three wars and a pile of training in between. Very few Glocks have seen anything close to the abuse those old 1911's weathered.

[RRS]

1911 more reliable than a Glock, hmm, as a hammer perhaps.

1911's were never noted for their reliability, durability yes, but not the other way around.

We all luv the design, its a sentimental favorite, but honestly no 1911 can survive the equivalent torture of running 1000 rds in rapid fire without  a failure, or being buried in dirt and mud, frozen, and still function, etc etc etc.

1911's are my favorite firearm, but not because of the reliability.

[jtallen83]

I questioned the durability statement, not reliability, the testing that led to the adoption of the 1911 did track reliability though;

http://www.sightm1911.com/lib/history/M1911_Trials.htm

Torture tests are fun to read about but have little to do with the real world application of the tool. If you are shooting a 1000 rounds rapid fire with a pistol in a real world situation then you have more to worry about than clearing a few malfunctions.

Love my 1911, can't stand the feel of a Glock, but if my life depended on a pistol I would grab my 226.

[RRS]

Ya the 1911 was the king of the hill for a long time.

I like the 320, have you shot it, seems like what the 226 should have been.

[jtallen83]

Haven't shot the 320 put I did get to dry fire one a bit, very nice trigger for a striker gun. If I ever buy [plastic that may be what I go with.

[ARTrooper]

RRS, I think glocks will be a contender for a long time to come. but I don't think they are unique anymore with the things that set them apart, plenty new models of pistols from different companies that may seem like copies (I could care less), but offer similar performance in some or all the areas that you pointed out for the benefits that the glocks.

striker fires like glocks are no longer ground breaking. reliability, safety, ease of maintenance, and reasonable price seem to be the standard with them these days, not just the glock exception. sure glocks might be a little cheaper, but not by much, and with companies like h&k, beretta, and sig jumping into the striker fire game at reasonable prices considering their history of more expensive pistols out of the price range of some (maybe not so much with beretta). Whole agencies have already switched over to the sig p320 already, and my agencies is entertaining the idea (hope they do switch). So in my opinion, if glock stays on top, it may be to save a penny here and there. but more likely it will just be the reluctance of change, same as the military has been reluctant to get away from .223 even though we all know there are better rounds out there.

glocks I believe will last a life time more and have their nitch even if they get replaced in militaries and law enforcement. they are good guns, no doubt; especially for the price. just like the 1911 will never go away as long as there are pistols to shoot. I love 1911s and single action pistols in general. a good SA with a thumb safety is as quick as any striker fire and safer even carrying locked and cocked like they are meant to. and the triggers are to die for, nothing compares. as for reliability, depends on the 1911. some 1911's have stiff springs and require high powered ammo; others the builders just messed with the original design to much and have had problems with them, this is this is the reason most of the 2011s aren't that reliable. but a decent 1911 can be just as reliable as any pistol out there if you ask me and just as easy to clean and maintain as a glock. then again I don't go around throwing my pistols in mud or anything like that, though I have fired in the rain a fair bit or in sandy environments.

the sig p320 has 2 thumbs up from me however. I would love to see this replace the glock. feels more comfortable, smooth crisp trigger with a very short reset. the trigger in my opinion is better than h&k's vp9/vp40 and any other striker fire I have shot so far. price is very very good, especially considering it is a sig. I think if you were to do a blind test, just putting a glock and p320 in the hands of the testers and letting them dry fire (don't want people shooting real rounds while they can't see :P), the majority would pick the p320 as the better gun. although like has been going on, there will always be those that just love glocks and nothing wrong with that.

[shepp]

I prefer Chevy over ford

[ARTrooper]

amen brother, they aren't the prettiest trucks, but a stock Silverado will get the job done time and time again.

[survivalshop]

 Ford F150 is King , don't ever forget it !

[shepp]

11 hours ago, ARTrooper said:

amen brother, they aren't the prettiest trucks, but a stock Silverado will get the job done time and time again.

I was being a smart ass because that's how these debates always go. I've never even touched a glock, I'm afraid I'll contract the brain worm all its fanboys have

[beantown]

4 hours ago, shepp said:

I was being a smart ass because that's how these debates always go. I've never even touched a glock, I'm afraid I'll contract the brain worm all its fanboys have

Glock Brain Worm. OMG I am so using that on a friend of mine. No known cure for the GBW at this time!