Roadk9 Posted March 23, 2018 Author Report Share Posted March 23, 2018 (edited) The overall result then is instead of overtravel I now am seeing under travel. For my next test I am using the Tubbs flat-wire AR10 spring. If no improvement I'll try the original Aero Precision spring. I will keep the gas block wide open. Meanwhile, the accuracy I'm seeing makes this effort worthwhile. I still need practice hence the two flyers. Edited March 23, 2018 by Roadk9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt.Cross Posted March 23, 2018 Report Share Posted March 23, 2018 Looks dry as a bone to me.... How wet are you running this thing? As for the gas block, you might find it less frustrating to start off with it all the way open, and close it as you shoot until the first malfunction. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edgecrusher Posted March 23, 2018 Report Share Posted March 23, 2018 1 hour ago, Matt.Cross said: Looks dry as a bone to me.... How wet are you running this thing? As for the gas block, you might find it less frustrating to start off with it all the way open, and close it as you shoot until the first malfunction. These large frame AR rifles should be near dripping wet until broken in. Even a lil in the buffer tube. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
COBrien Posted March 23, 2018 Report Share Posted March 23, 2018 22 minutes ago, edgecrusher said: These large frame AR rifles should be near dripping wet until broken in. Even a lil in the buffer tube. Yep. I coat the inside of the upper with Mobil 1 15W-50, soak my BCG in a bowl of 15W-50, sling off some excess, and slide 'er in. So many problems can be solved with more lubrication. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floydieguns Posted March 23, 2018 Report Share Posted March 23, 2018 This stuff works for me. During the break in, my rifles are blowing oil out the charge handle, down through the magazine(literally the magazine drips oil) and well.. everywhere else. Each time I would snake bore, into oil bath the carrier group went. Are you capable of pulling the bolt carrier group into a last round hold open position via charge handle and empty magazine? Seems silly but... Bummer about this rifle being wonky. I know how that goes. Likely so does everyone else here as well!! I use slip-2000 spray can white litheum grease inside the buffer tube. It makes a huge mess when blowing out the vent hole but.. every little placebo affect I know gets thrown when doing break in. People claim it helps with noise reduction. Does it? I never can tell.. nonetheless, it gets greased. Darn messy when removing your action spring too. That ear swab is amazing for dripping oil in just the right places. Get that 'qtip' soaked up, gently roll it against the tuperware edge to prevent accidental mess. Applying pressure with the cotton end to desired location and oil drips out like a sponge. Amazing how a fresh film of oil will hold light parts akin to glue. Can opener was rusty and sat in the oil vat for a while to be freed up.. nothing special there. ;-) One of these guys will help get you running. Best wishes and luck to you, Floydie Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jtallen83 Posted March 24, 2018 Report Share Posted March 24, 2018 Are you sure of the gas block alignment. You can tell if it is correct by sliding it forward and looking for the shadow left by the larger gas block port around the barrel gas port. If it shows an even shadow around the port then you may need a larger port. Check the size while you have it off, there is a gas port size thread that lists lots of configurations and the port size that works for them. I have had to open up two different barrels so far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadk9 Posted March 24, 2018 Author Report Share Posted March 24, 2018 Thanks all for the suggestions. I will use more oil today when I try it with the new spring. Lots more oil.. the gas block alignment will be the next check if things don't go well today.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadk9 Posted March 25, 2018 Author Report Share Posted March 25, 2018 23 hours ago, jtallen83 said: Are you sure of the gas block alignment. You can tell if it is correct by sliding it forward and looking for the shadow left by the larger gas block port around the barrel gas port. If it shows an even shadow around the port then you may need a larger port. Check the size while you have it off, there is a gas port size thread that lists lots of configurations and the port size that works for them. I have had to open up two different barrels so far. I am not sure of the gas block alignment. I had the gas block installed by a local gunsmith. I will pull it and make the check you describe. Today at the range with the BCG really dripping with oil it worked much better than previously. The Tubbs spring seemed to allow the BCG to travel its full range most of the time. I say most because there still were a few times where it didn't, and a jam resulted. But on two empty mags it did lock open on the bolt lock. I don't think the buffer tube, spring or buffer are causing the problem now. The next check as described by jtallen83 will be done tomorrow. If I can find the thread he mentioned I will check that and maybe I will need to open the gas port more. I don't think the adjustable gas block should need to be all the way open to allow the rifle to function properly. This is a real learning experience, I am enjoying it, mostly because I see that the rifle is capable of real accuracy. At least it is when I figure out out how to get a good shooting position consistently. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted March 25, 2018 Report Share Posted March 25, 2018 3 minutes ago, Roadk9 said: I don't think the adjustable gas block should need to be all the way open to allow the rifle to function properly. Doesn't matter if that's what you think. Do it anyway. Don't count that out. Open that thing up ALL the way and shoot it. If you DON'T do that, you don't know about your gas port sizing. You're guessing, without doing that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted March 25, 2018 Report Share Posted March 25, 2018 (edited) Back to my mantra. Don't complicate shiit with complicated shiit. Never start a new rifle build with complicated shiit. Never. New rifles need this many "adjustable" anything on them... ZERO. Build a functioning rifle first, then modify it to suit your needs. Edited March 25, 2018 by 98Z5V Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadk9 Posted March 25, 2018 Author Report Share Posted March 25, 2018 14 minutes ago, 98Z5V said: Don't complicate shiit with complicated shiit. Got it, and will remember that for future builds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jtallen83 Posted March 25, 2018 Report Share Posted March 25, 2018 18 minutes ago, Roadk9 said: I don't think the adjustable gas block should need to be all the way open to allow the rifle to function properly. True, an adjustable block is a waste if you have to run it wide open but you if you do need to open the port you need to run it open as 98 described. My methodology was to open the port up till what I knew was weak ammo functioned the rifle. Then I could adjust do9wn from there for the hotter match ammo I shoot most often, down some more when using a suppressor. This way I know I have a rifle that I can tune to anything I may need to run in it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted March 25, 2018 Report Share Posted March 25, 2018 Here's the deal with adjustable gas blocks. If your rifle doesn't function, you max out the adjustble gas block. WFO, like a 2-stroke dirtbike. Wide Fuckin' Open. If it doesn't function THEN, your gas port in your barrel is too small. Drill it up. That is the only way you're gonna find that out. Max it. Always start with it maxed out. Or, don't use one from the get-go, and just use a standard gas block. You move to an adjustable when you need to... I hate complicated shiit... These rifles weren't designed around it/them, and they don't need it to function correctly... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt.Cross Posted March 25, 2018 Report Share Posted March 25, 2018 Something to keep in mind when diagnosing a new build or new gun; nothing is broken in yet. You need to get the gun running in the simplest possible configuration until several hundred rounds have gone reliably downrange. Once the moving parts of your rifle have settled into a steady consistent 'working relationship', then you can adjust your gas system back knowing that you've eliminated the extra friction that results from all the parts being brand new. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadk9 Posted March 25, 2018 Author Report Share Posted March 25, 2018 Hah! I disassembled the gas system today (just now). I used drill bits to measure the holes. What I found is simple, the marking around the port on the barrel covers the port (centered) the same marking on the gas block is centered on the port there. So the gas block is aligned correctly. I dropped a .125" bit into the gas block and it went into the tube. Double checked that. So the tube and the block are .125". The barrel though is not so pretty. All I could get in the port is .0625", and that doesn't go in smooth. The barrel is an 18" mid port design, I think the port could be larger. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted March 25, 2018 Report Share Posted March 25, 2018 13 minutes ago, Roadk9 said: The barrel though is not so pretty. All I could get in the port is .0625", and that doesn't go in smooth. The barrel is an 18" mid port design, I think the port could be larger. WOW!!! That needs drilled up, and I'd start at 0.080." Hit our gas port thread of info, and check out common, operating sizes... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magwa Posted March 25, 2018 Report Share Posted March 25, 2018 18 hours ago, 98Z5V said: Back to my mantra. Don't complicate shiit with complicated shiit. Never start a new rifle build with complicated shiit. Never. New rifles need this many "adjustable" anything on them... ZERO. Build a functioning rifle first, then modify it to suit your needs. A Fuking Men! I got rid of all my complicated $hit! and tada everything works except my immune system it is fubared! Listen to this man he knows his $hit! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floydieguns Posted March 25, 2018 Report Share Posted March 25, 2018 That barrel manufacturer is a wee-bit off... Your gas port was drilled at roughly 1/16th of an inch. I would try 3/32 which is 0.09375" as a last resort. 5/64 is a tad too small, being 0.078125". If you have a numbered drill bit set try #46 and work up to #44. If still having issues grab the 3/32. Remember #46 drill bit is smaller than #44. The smaller numbers are bigger bits. Be warned, if it is a chrome lined barrel.. you may be in for a nightmare. Carbide bit can be broken off due to a snag in chrome lining. Will ruin your day. Try HSS, lubricants and steady work pace. That jobber can never take too long. Patience. Glad you found the problem, now it is time for corrective repair. Best luck! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted March 25, 2018 Report Share Posted March 25, 2018 2 hours ago, Floydieguns said: That barrel manufacturer is a wee-bit off... Your gas port was drilled at roughly 1/16th of an inch. I would try 3/32 which is 0.09375" as a last resort. 5/64 is a tad too small, being 0.078125". If you have a numbered drill bit set try #46 and work up to #44. If still having issues grab the 3/32. Remember #46 drill bit is smaller than #44. The smaller numbers are bigger bits. Be warned, if it is a chrome lined barrel.. you may be in for a nightmare. Carbide bit can be broken off due to a snag in chrome lining. Will ruin your day. Try HSS, lubricants and steady work pace. That jobber can never take too long. Patience. Glad you found the problem, now it is time for corrective repair. Best luck! We've been through this alot. Doesn't matter what the barrel material is, you drill slow, and use very light pressure - let the bit do the work, and don't force it. Put a 1/4" wooden dowel down the barrel so you don't go through and hit the other side. Fractional bits don't get it for recommendations, so the use of fractional bits as guidance is pretty much worthless. Always use numbered bits for gasport sizing - as you did further in your post. It's worth a trip to Ace Hardware for proper numbered bits in a very select size range, over using fractional bits from your drill index in the garage... Just so you know, there are some barrel combinations that will require a 0.100" gas port for a .308 Win round, so advising 0.093" as a last resort won't always be the case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floydieguns Posted March 26, 2018 Report Share Posted March 26, 2018 36 minutes ago, 98Z5V said: We've been through this alot. Doesn't matter what the barrel material is, you drill slow, and use very light pressure - let the bit do the work, and don't force it. Put a 1/4" wooden dowel down the barrel so you don't go through and hit the other side. Fractional bits don't get it for recommendations, so the use of fractional bits as guidance is pretty much worthless. Always use numbered bits for gasport sizing - as you did further in your post. It's worth a trip to Ace Hardware for proper numbered bits in a very select size range, over using fractional bits from your drill index in the garage... Just so you know, there are some barrel combinations that will require a 0.100" gas port for a .308 Win round, so advising 0.093" as a last resort won't always be the case. Appreciated, kind sir. My mistake for providing non-accepted informations. I hope it may be retracted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted March 26, 2018 Report Share Posted March 26, 2018 1 minute ago, Floydieguns said: Appreciated, kind sir. My mistake for providing non-accepted informations. I hope it may be retracted. Doesn't need retracted, man, and it's certainly not "non-accepted." Just letting you know about the information that you provided, that's all. These aren't .45s, and we're pretty well versed on them. Oh, and there's no way I'd try to build a 1911, on my own... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt.Cross Posted March 26, 2018 Report Share Posted March 26, 2018 I've got access to every size drill you can imagine. If you need one in particular, PM me and I'll send you whatever you need. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sketch Posted March 26, 2018 Report Share Posted March 26, 2018 ive done some drilling and picked up the colbot ( spelling?) bits for the port hole. dont skimp and break off a bit in the port hole. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadk9 Posted March 26, 2018 Author Report Share Posted March 26, 2018 1 hour ago, 98Z5V said: Doesn't need retracted, man, and it's certainly not "non-accepted." Just letting you know about the information that you provided, that's all. These aren't .45s, and we're pretty well versed on them. Oh, and there's no way I'd try to build a 1911, on my own... On that note: I built my first 1911 in 1976 in Augsburg, Germany. I mailed most of it home when I DEROSed in January 1977. That got the attention of CID who promptly intercepted me on my way to Rhein Mein for a MAC flight. In a quiet interrogation room later I was presented with the evidence of theft of US Govt poverty and read my rights, to which I responded with the documentation of the purchase of said property from one retired US Army Colonel living in Seattle, WA. Some embarrassed agents then gave me a ride to try to make my flight, which I missed, causing me to arrive at Ft Dix too late to process, further causing me to spend one cold assed weekend there waiting until the processing center opened on the following Monday. Ah the memories..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadk9 Posted March 26, 2018 Author Report Share Posted March 26, 2018 1 hour ago, Matt.Cross said: I've got access to every size drill you can imagine. If you need one in particular, PM me and I'll send you whatever you need. Wow! what a nice offer. But I'll defer to the skilled services of my local gunsmith on that. I have a drill press, but using bits that small, on a $300 barrel, makes me nervous. Said 'smith has the tools and experience to get the job done. I will ask him to open it to .090 to .100. I am using an adjustable gas block so I can close it down to whatever allows it to function best once I reassemble it. I'll take this opportunity to thank you all, especially 98Z5W, and the new guy Floydie for the suggestions, advice and guidance. You are appreciated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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