MaineMan2 Posted March 4, 2022 Report Share Posted March 4, 2022 A friend wants a lightweight AR for hunting. I recently built a What Would Stoner Do AR-15 (InRangeTV). It is really light and handles beautifully. So we want to head in the same direction but in 308. (Yes I’ve read the necro threads on this topic) The barrel seems like the biggest potential weight savings. He wants 18” and no shorter. While the Faxon 5.56 pencil barrel is kind of amazing, I’m leaning toward their “Gunner” profile for 308… it’s only a few ounces more. Ballistic Advantage has a “Hanson” profile and looks like high quality, but it does weigh almost 3/4 pound more than the Faxon. Same with Rainier Arms “Match” barrel. He’s looking for quality but carbon fiber wrapped barrel - no. Several concerns about Faxon: I keep reading that their barrels are “deliberately over-gassed” although my sample of one doesn’t seem to have a problem (5.56 pencil, mid-length gas). I did have a problem with a crooked gas key on the Faxon BCG and had an issue with a slight rough machining mark on the bolt face. I’ve recently done a build with the Aero Precision M5E1 enhanced receiver set and handguard. I really like their enhanced handguard attachment. Rock solid with fewer parts to have tolerance stacking. However, it is not especially light. I’m leaning toward a normal AP 308 receiver set with a lighter weight handguard. Any input appreciated. If I can talk him into a fixed rifle stock, I’ve got just the thing for light weight. Any thoughts, insights, etc. appreciated! Chip Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DNP Posted March 4, 2022 Report Share Posted March 4, 2022 (edited) I can’t say for certain, but what I’ve seen coming through this forum…99% of people who believe their gun in “over gassed” are really dealing with a gun that is “under assed” and have too light of a buffer installed. The buffer will not be a good spot for you to shave a couple ounces. Edited March 4, 2022 by DNP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MtnMike Posted March 4, 2022 Report Share Posted March 4, 2022 As it appears you hail from Maine, I'd definitely recommend looking into Windham Weaponry. Great folks. Great Warranty. Great customer service. Not the lightest, but lighter than most. Rock solid reliable and accurate. Have not had a single FTF using about a dozen different types of ammo. Mine ended up coming in at just under 9# including optics. Photos below on scale w/everything installed, including optics and 10rnd magazine (no bullets). Could have made it about half lb. lighter if I'd gone with a 40mm scope instead of 50mm and a lighter buttstock. But I felt those particular upgrades were worth the added weight. Granted it is a 16.5" barrel. But, I'm consistently getting 1" 3-bullet groups at 100 yds with 180g Fed Nontypical Whitetail. Works for me. POF .308s are about the lightest options out there that I've seen. But I've read enough reviews with reliability issues and reports of poor customer service there to keep me away. (Hearsay-I know - take it for what its worth). Next to barrels, optics and mounts seem to be the biggest variables for weight. I really like Leupold non-illuminated scopes for their lightness, optic quality and durability. Keep us posted with what you decide! Love seeing what other folks do. More than one way to skin a cat as we say down here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaineMan2 Posted March 4, 2022 Author Report Share Posted March 4, 2022 (edited) 49 minutes ago, MtnMike said: As it appears you hail from Maine, I'd definitely recommend looking into Windham Weaponry. Great folks. Great Warranty. Great customer service. Not the lightest, but lighter than most. Rock solid reliable and accurate. Have not had a single FTF using about a dozen different types of ammo. Mine ended up coming in at just under 9# including optics. Photos below on scale w/everything installed, including optics and 10rnd magazine (no bullets). Could have made it about half lb. lighter if I'd gone with a 40mm scope instead of 50mm and a lighter buttstock. But I felt those particular upgrades were worth the added weight. Granted it is a 16.5" barrel. But, I'm consistently getting 1" 3-bullet groups at 100 yds with 180g Fed Nontypical Whitetail. Works for me. POF .308s are about the lightest options out there that I've seen. But I've read enough reviews with reliability issues and reports of poor customer service there to keep me away. (Hearsay-I know - take it for what its worth). Next to barrels, optics and mounts seem to be the biggest variables for weight. I really like Leupold non-illuminated scopes for their lightness, optic quality and durability. Keep us posted with what you decide! Love seeing what other folks do. More than one way to skin a cat as we say down here. Hi Mike - yes Windham Weaponry puts together fine firearms. I have the same rifle you do including the 16.5" barrel. It is relatively light for a 308 AR, but I'm fairly sure I can put together just as good a hunting rifle that weighs less. You make an excellent point about saving weight on the optic and we'll have to keep that in mind. I'm a big fan of traditional Leupold optics as well. Thanks! In addition to all of the other considerations, I simply enjoy the process of selecting parts, testing, and getting it right (eventually?). DNP - I've spent a fair amount of time lurking here and reading up on gas systems, buffers, and related issues. I learned a lot. My comment on "over gassed" Faxon barrels related to AR-15s, and anyone silly enough to cut weight by getting a lighter buffer shouldn't be assembling Lincoln logs, let alone rifles. Edited March 4, 2022 by MaineMan2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted March 5, 2022 Report Share Posted March 5, 2022 11 hours ago, MaineMan2 said: and anyone silly enough to cut weight by getting a lighter buffer shouldn't be assembling Lincoln logs, let alone rifles. I really, really like this statement... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unforgiven Posted March 9, 2022 Report Share Posted March 9, 2022 We had a guy who was going to glue on a butt pad because he couldn't bring himself to attach with screws. 🤔 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cunuckgaucho Posted March 10, 2022 Report Share Posted March 10, 2022 12 hours ago, unforgiven said: We had a guy who was going to glue on a butt pad because he couldn't bring himself to attach with screws. 🤔 If you sniff the glue first anything seems possible Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaineMan2 Posted September 20, 2022 Author Report Share Posted September 20, 2022 Update: finally getting off the ground with this project. I contacted Aero Precision and asked about the weight of their “enhanced” receiver and handguard vs. their regular M5 upper and an Atlas S-One handguard. Guy surprised me when he said that the enhanced setup weighed 1/2 pound more. Yes, it’s really solid but 1/2 pound? Not for this build. Here’s what I’m thinking about for a critical parts list: Aero Precison M5 lower & upper receivers, Atlas S-One 15” handguard, BCG, rifle length buffer tube kit. Faxon Big Gunner profile 16” barrel with “mid-length” gas system (Does anyone know if I need to find an odd length gas tube for this?) Haven’t decided on trigger yet. Rifle stock? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted September 20, 2022 Report Share Posted September 20, 2022 16" barrel, but why the weight of a 15" handguard, when the design is for a lightweight gun? Go shorter. Go 10" if you can. You don't need that much rail on that config, if weight is your priority. My $0.02. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaineMan2 Posted September 20, 2022 Author Report Share Posted September 20, 2022 8 hours ago, 98Z5V said: 16" barrel, but why the weight of a 15" handguard, when the design is for a lightweight gun? Go shorter. Go 10" if you can. You don't need that much rail on that config, if weight is your priority. My $0.02. Good question! I instinctively went with 15” handguard for longer sight radius, but that hardly applies in this context since there will be an optic. Extra 3” weighs 1-1/2 ounces more. Optics Planet would change order but doesn’t have 12” black and neither does anyone else that I can find quickly. I do prefer to have the gas block covered. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MtnMike Posted September 21, 2022 Report Share Posted September 21, 2022 (edited) I like the Larue MST 2s for hunting. Very good trigger for the $ IMO. Lightest collapsible stock I've actually seen is probably the Mission First Minimalist, listed at 5.8 oz. For comparison, the "standard" collapsible stock that came with my WW weighed in at 7.25 oz (and rattled a bit), the Daniel Defense collapsible (that I went with for my hunting AR10 build) weighed 7.65 oz, and the Magpul MOE SL from my AR 15 weighed 9.5 oz. Edited September 21, 2022 by MtnMike typo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted September 21, 2022 Report Share Posted September 21, 2022 (edited) 13 hours ago, MaineMan2 said: Good question! I instinctively went with 15” handguard for longer sight radius, but that hardly applies in this context since there will be an optic. Extra 3” weighs 1-1/2 ounces more. Optics Planet would change order but doesn’t have 12” black and neither does anyone else that I can find quickly. I do prefer to have the gas block covered. My .358 Win is a 16" midlength gas barrel, with a 10" rail. I'll dig up a pic. Gas block is exposed, and it's not that bad. I don't care if the block is exposed - nothing is going to happen to it anyway. EDIT - Found it: Edited September 21, 2022 by 98Z5V Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MtnMike Posted September 21, 2022 Report Share Posted September 21, 2022 ran across this fairly light 12" rail - might work - don't know for sure https://www.2a-arms.com/product-p/2a-bshg-12.htm Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MtnMike Posted September 21, 2022 Report Share Posted September 21, 2022 https://monstrumtactical.com/dpms-lr-308-m-lok-handguard-10-inch-free-float-high-profile/ maybe a more likely candidate Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaineMan2 Posted September 21, 2022 Author Report Share Posted September 21, 2022 Thanks guys! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted September 23, 2022 Report Share Posted September 23, 2022 On 9/21/2022 at 3:28 AM, MtnMike said: ran across this fairly light 12" rail - might work - don't know for sure https://www.2a-arms.com/product-p/2a-bshg-12.htm This one is alot lighter than that shorter one from Monstrum. Grab that 12" from 2A. It's almost 6oz lighter. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jim3326 Posted September 23, 2022 Report Share Posted September 23, 2022 On 9/21/2022 at 6:12 AM, MaineMan2 said: Thanks guys! Double check your rail height, the one posted is a high rail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted September 23, 2022 Report Share Posted September 23, 2022 (edited) 3 minutes ago, jim3326 said: Double check your rail height, the one posted is a high rail. All Aero M5 uppers are DPMS-High. Edited September 23, 2022 by 98Z5V Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jim3326 Posted September 23, 2022 Report Share Posted September 23, 2022 (edited) Edited September 23, 2022 by jim3326 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jim3326 Posted September 23, 2022 Report Share Posted September 23, 2022 32 minutes ago, 98Z5V said: All Aero M5 uppers are DPMS-High. New wrinkle on the brain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MaineMan2 Posted September 23, 2022 Author Report Share Posted September 23, 2022 10 hours ago, 98Z5V said: All Aero M5 uppers are DPMS-High. Thanks - did not have that in long-term memory. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMJ Posted September 23, 2022 Report Share Posted September 23, 2022 On 9/20/2022 at 11:28 PM, 98Z5V said: My .358 Win is a 16" midlength gas barrel, with a 10" rail. I'll dig up a pic. Gas block is exposed, and it's not that bad. I don't care if the block is exposed - nothing is going to happen to it anyway. EDIT - Found it: That’s one sexy rifle! I had the pleasure of shooting a 358win chambered in a Ruger M77 one day at the range. I didn’t know about it before that day and immediately thought it was an awesome round that I wish was more popular. It and 7-08 are the main two I’d like to build additional uppers in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted September 24, 2022 Report Share Posted September 24, 2022 7 hours ago, JMJ said: It and 7-08 are the main two I’d like to build additional uppers in. I have a 7mm-08 AR in the works, man. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted September 24, 2022 Report Share Posted September 24, 2022 (edited) @jim3326, My brain has to look like a Sharpei dog. I don't know how useful the information is, that's tucked in there, but there's a whole LOT of shiit. Torque specs for things I'll never work on again, measurements to a shelf I built in an old house that I sold on 2007. Etc. There's alot backed up in there, and it flashes forward now and again - but I don't know how useful it is anymore. I haven't figured out how to format that brainpan hard drive yet, and get the useless shiit out. Edited September 24, 2022 by 98Z5V Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jim3326 Posted September 24, 2022 Report Share Posted September 24, 2022 @98Z5VI hear ya there. I still have the phone numbers from 55 years ago rattling around. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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