Using .308 AR for SHTF

[edgecrusher]

simple answer, yes  <thumbsup> :hethan: i have two

[fr3db3ar]

I have reloading equipment and supplies to enhance my total ammo available at the least cost.  I do not have space for a loading bench.  I use a Lee Loader and a Lee Hand Press,  Lee beam powder scale,  powder trickler,  rubber & plastic hammer,  caliper.  My reloaded ammo is precise,  shoots as well as the factory  ammo I buy (or better).  The cost of equipment is minimal.  I push the keyboard out of the way and load on my computer desk.

Have you been in my mancave taking pictures?  Other than a couple brand name differences that is my exact setup....even pushing the keyboard out of the way to load  <laughs> <thumbsup>

[SHTF .308]

simple answer, yes  <thumbsup> :hethan: i have two

I appreciate the input you have provided thus far

[Retired JM]

If I remember correctly,  from those who were in combat in Viet Nam,  200 rounds on your person per gun carried and at least a 1000 rounds readily available per gun.  It would be interesting to know what is the common wisdom coming out of Iraq and Afghanistan.

Can't speak for everybody, but my guys usually took 11-14 mags. My minimum was 11, but most of my guys took more than that.

[planeflyer21]

SHTF guns are subjective.  The most important one you can have is your handgun, as that should be on your person and allow you to get back to the nearest and most effective long gun for the situation at hand.

Lots of folks carry truckguns.  These are usually a beater long gun that is easy-handling and will take care of most situations on a day-to-day basis.  Popular ones I've seen are Mini14s and lever-guns in handgun calibers. 

For my SHTF it will be either a lever gun in .357 or .45 Colt, or my new Elite Operator, Liberty.  Chances are for me crap will hit while I'm in a fairly urban environment.  Accuracy is essential to 70 yards and not really much more than that.  If the opportunity/situation mandates a relocation to a rural or wilderness environment, I'm packing lots of .22-caliber guns.  More ammo, less noise.

Jon

[Dusty44]

To fr3db3ar :  Glad to know I am not the only one in this 'community' who gets by with minimalist loading equipment.  I bought an RCBS 'Universal' priming tool yesterday from MidwayUSA.  I have been using the Lee Loader system to prime all cases.  I am comfortable with that and can feel the primer slip into place.  It is a bit slow and hopefully the new tool will work easier and faster.

[Robocop1051]

I like my AR's but I'm not planning on them to survive. I'd fear a guy defending his home with a 10/22 before I fear someone assaulting mine with any black rifle of any make or caliber.

[Dusty44]

Lever guns are really not very accurate,  usually.  This is often mentioned in magazine articles.  My Marlin 1894 in 44 mag makes neat patterns with 300 gr hard cast (Cast Performance,  300 gr  WFNGC over a maximum charge of IMR 4227).  I have a target on file with 14 neat holes packed into a 3 inch disk at 50 yards.  Any other ammo opens up a lot.  All factory and my handloaded ammo does fine in my 4 inch 'N' frame Smith out to at least 25 yards.

[Robocop1051]

I have a pair of Browning Mod92's in .357 and .44mag,

I've shot a few of those hand load 300gr at oinkers upto 50 yards. If I want to stretch to 100 yards, I shoot 210gr for the flatter flight.

My .357 is loaded with 125gr and has killed everything from squirrels to coastal blacktail deer. That rifle and a double barrel .410 sat in the back of my Dads truck for years.

[planeflyer21]

My Marlin 1894C was plenty accurate.  With 6.8gr of Herco under 158gr RNFPL, it would put all NINE rounds into one ragged hole at 50 yards, with those crappy stock buckhorn sights.

I gave that as a wedding present to my niece and her hubby.

I've not measured my other levers for groups but can consistently hit steel milkjugs at 220yds, with either my .357 or .45 Colt.

A buddy on MO consistently gets half-MOA at 100 yards with his Marlins.  Another guy loads up his .30-30 with BTHPs and spitzers, shooting it for accuracy out to 600yds.

I took the .357 on the annual "Dude's Trip", and everyone was able to keep a Gatorade jug bouncing for a whole magazine.

Plenty good enough for someone demanding rice and water from me in SHTF.

Jon

[swamp_stalker]

For SHTF, I would be reaching past my AR15's to grab my 12ga and 22 mag bolt gun. In SE Louisiana where I live there are very few long range shooting opportunities, and 000 Buck will take down anything on 4 legs within 30 yards. For small game nothing will compare to a 22 rim fire. Dirt cheap ammo and you can stock pile a butt load of it.

That being said, I have a LAR-8 on order and will be setting aside 308 ammo from this day forward  :).

[Guest LLArms]

All of my ARs in .308 are heavy bull barrel setups for long distance. I don't think its considered defense when you start shooting people at long distance.

I think one of my AR-15s and a shotgun would be the first thing I'd want to pickup.

I suppose .308 would be good perimeter control for a zombie invasion...  <lmao>

With that said - little bit of "tin foil hat" going on here....  :P

[Robocop1051]

With that said - little bit of "tin foil hat" going on here....  :P

The first page and half definitely had some 12 Monkey babble going on. Those with the appropriate experience spoke up, addressed the issue very eloquently, and by page 3 we were back to reality.

Every gun website has at least one of "them" at any given time. The legend of Gecko45 comes in many shapes and sizes. To be honest, when obviously untrained people start talking about stockpiling and fortifying, it scares the beejeezus outta me. Especially when they turn to the free unfiltered advice of the Internet for training advice. You end up with a dozen guys who jack off to Chris Costa videos sharing their interpretation like its gospel. It's a hell of a way to introduce yourself to a new forum too.

Sorry, I just woke up and this thread irked the piss out of me for days before I posted. You could tell the direction this thread was going when the OP decided to throw proper english and grammar skills out the door to get his point across.

The reality is our government has so many layers, it will never be able to implode on itself. There will always be some form of establishment. Furthermore, there will never be another civil war or revolution due to the fact that so many are currently dependant on Government aid. Second, no country possesses the manpower or fuel to occupy our lands. The expanse is too vast, and our population too well armed. Every General across the globe knows this. Zombies, 12/21/2012, and other apocolypse scenarios make box office $$$... That's it. The only thing left is nukes. Plausible?? Except that every 3rd world dictator knows we possess the ability to cause genocide to any country on this planet as a response to any nuclear attack on our soil. I'm more worried about running into a crackhead looking to score his next fix than I am for any "SHTF" scenario.

Why can't we just buy and build guns because they are fun and we're addicts for big bangs. Let those "other" sites deal with SHTF preparedness plans.

[SHTF .308]

The first page and half definitely had some 12 Monkey babble going on. Those with the appropriate experience spoke up, addressed the issue very eloquently, and by page 3 we were back to reality.

Every gun website has at least one of "them" at any given time. The legend of Gecko45 comes in many shapes and sizes. To be honest, when obviously untrained people start talking about stockpiling and fortifying, it scares the beejeezus outta me. Especially when they turn to the free unfiltered advice of the Internet for training advice. You end up with a dozen guys who jack off to Chris Costa videos sharing their interpretation like its gospel. It's a hell of a way to introduce yourself to a new forum too.

Sorry, I just woke up and this thread irked the piss out of me for days before I posted. You could tell the direction this thread was going when the OP decided to throw proper english and grammar skills out the door to get his point across.

The reality is our government has so many layers, it will never be able to implode on itself. There will always be some form of establishment. Furthermore, there will never be another civil war or revolution due to the fact that so many are currently dependant on Government aid. Second, no country possesses the manpower or fuel to occupy our lands. The expanse is too vast, and our population too well armed. Every General across the globe knows this. Zombies, 12/21/2012, and other apocolypse scenarios make box office $$$... That's it. The only thing left is nukes. Plausible?? Except that every 3rd world dictator knows we possess the ability to cause genocide to any country on this planet as a response to any nuclear attack on our soil. I'm more worried about running into a crackhead looking to score his next fix than I am for any "SHTF" scenario.

Why can't we just buy and build guns because they are fun and we're addicts for big bangs. Let those "other" sites deal with SHTF preparedness plans.

My intent is not to use this thread as Gospel, I look it as asking people who I would think have some sort of experience using the weapon platform in question personally. I have never shot any AR platformed weapon and after doing research on it vs the many other types of guns there are to choose from in this caliber I decided to ask you all what you thought about it as it pertained to my main purpose for purchasing one.

I outline before I think on page two its versatility I could use it as a Long Range gun at a range or site large enough to let me do so and then still have the capability to use it for CQB. This was answered respectfully by sum and distastefully by others personally I don't care because anyone can say what they want behind a screen. I take every bit of information I get from the internet as a grain of salt unless I can prove it against professional and or expert facts and opinions.

To me SHTF does not include 2012 because we have Galactic alignments yearly on that very same date. SHTF perhaps may be more dire to me than it is for someone else, I mean I do live in South Florida where we do have hurricanes; up until Katrina we had the most costly hurricane to date named Andrew in 92 and in 2005 we had Wilma which left the Tri-County area without power for weeks as long as 5 weeks in some areas. We had looting, trolling by scavengers who wanted to pick off what they could etc.

With that said this is not a thread I started to introduce myself but since it was my first I thought it would be courteous to do so. I started this thread to get ideas and insight on a topic that has risen to the top as the forefront of discussion by many Americans.

All to often we hear about Americans who don't have faith in their Government, or see the actions of the incumbent president as a seed to tyranny, or the floundering economy as perhaps not having the resiliency it once had long ago.

The question was merely about protection of ones self in the event that all hell breaks loose and the government cannot respond in time enough to stop it from becoming state, region or hell even worse nationwide. likewise, if you really believe that this country will continue to stand the test of time as a major superpower, which I respect as your opinion. I'm really not sure i would agree with that because all great civilizations rise, flourish and then fall, just look at Rome, imperial Japan, Mongolia, Ottomans, Egyptians, French, and the Greek civilizations that all had a lot of wealth and ability to cope with most any situation yet they failed because they did not take the time to recognize their inherent weaknesses.

I love my country I am a patriot to the day I die but in the event we are invaded by China or Russia because we decided to engage Iran over oil or back Israel because they want to strike before they are, then I'm sure you would want to be ready as well even if that meant you were going to die, the idea we all have is an unyielding spirit and devotion toward our country it's citizens and our liberties I just want to protect those as best I can while sitting my fata** at home minding my own business until evil comes knocking at my door at which it may be too late but I will go down knowing I gave it my all and was prepared the best way I could be.

All I ask for is an opinion on how anyone that responds to this thread feels about this platform at that caliber in that type of situation whether it be hunting or whatever what are your pros and cons. I mean (in essence) since you have shot this gun for hunting purposes with the properties of therein would you use it in a defensive scenario if you had enough where with all to do so?

[Matt.Cross]

THREAD POLICE --> C:-) C:-) C:-)

The thread police are watching!

[SHTF .308]

THREAD POLICE --> C:-) C:-) C:-)

The thread police are watching!

Did i say something offensive? If I did I apologize

[Matt.Cross]

Did i say something offensive? If I did I apologize

Nothing offensive was said, I feel like both sides made their point very well and very clearly. I just don't want the thread to take a turn for the worse. No apology is necessary, but we always appreciate the spirit of cooperation. Carry on!  :)

[unforgiven]

Well said brother Robo....nuff.

[seakrakken]

<thumbsup>SHTF .308

.308 is the right way to go.

It has real punch, accuracy, is affordable and is easy to reload.

The AR platform is easy to shoot and maintain.

All in all, it is my 1st choice in all situations, ranging from plinking to EOWAWKI.

[SHTF .308]

<thumbsup>SHTF .308

.308 is the right way to go.

It has real punch, accuracy, is affordable and is easy to reload.

The AR platform is easy to shoot and maintain.

All in all, it is my 1st choice in all situations, ranging from plinking to EOWAWKI.

Sweet thanks for the input, What type of ammo you recommend stockpiling

[fr3db3ar]

Whatever shoots well in YOUR gun.  <thumbsup>

[planeflyer21]

Whatever shoots well in YOUR gun.  <thumbsup>

And therein lies one of the mysteries of the gun world.  A person can take five guns off the same production line, one after the other, identical in features and they all shoot differently.  One may like anything you feed it, another may only like bullets of a certain weight or heavy or light bullets, another may shoot like a shotgun.

If you reload it is the hook, line, and sinker.

Jon

[Rojodiablo]

how much ammo would you recommend to start with. Also I gotta ask Have you ever thought of firing russian steel cased ammo at all?

Bushmaster 308 ORC that you are looking at. It likes Wolf/WPA steel cased ammo just fine; 200-300 rounds in a few hours last weekend. It will not be choice #1 with regards to weather resistance, but in most cases, it is just fine, and the price is excellent. I am about 1.5 MOA at 100yds, then out to 200 yds I am more like 4 MOA. (At 200 yds with that ammo, I am grouping about 8" with a low power optic. Just put a 6x on, and expect this to get better.)

I'll not comment on concerns of social unrest- it might, it might not.

What I will say is, the Bushmaster is accurate, reliable, and not too terribly heavy. It will take on a lot of feral pigs in the next few months. Using a 40mm red dot, it is a very easy to use rifle.

[SHTF .308]

Bushmaster 308 ORC that you are looking at. It likes Wolf/WPA steel cased ammo just fine; 200-300 rounds in a few hours last weekend. It will not be choice #1 with regards to weather resistance, but in most cases, it is just fine, and the price is excellent. I am about 1.5 MOA at 100yds, then out to 200 yds I am more like 4 MOA. (At 200 yds with that ammo, I am grouping about 8" with a low power optic. Just put a 6x on, and expect this to get better.)

I'll not comment on concerns of social unrest- it might, it might not.

What I will say is, the Bushmaster is accurate, reliable, and not too terribly heavy. It will take on a lot of feral pigs in the next few months. Using a 40mm red dot, it is a very easy to use rifle.

I was looking into that one as well, I was actually leaning toward that one because it already has the magpul accessories installed and will come out to about the same price it would cost me to do the same with the DPMS.

how do you feel about adding a brake to it preferably the one from Primary Weapons Systems?

[98Z5V]

First, this thread makes my head hurt with the amount of Rambo-fantasy bullpoopy that's being tossed about.  I'll have to read this two or three more times just to be able to comprehend what some of these wildass goals really are for some of you.

Next.  ENGLISH is a requirement on this message board.  It's never really been specified before - but it's never been needed before, either.  poop like this below is NOT going to go here:

It wud b used only...

My opinion, and my opinion only - if you're so damn lazy that you can't type out some real ENGRISH, then don't even bother - don't even post.  I'm not going to waste what little time I have trying to decipher your bullpoopy.  I'm not texting you, and you're not texting me - it's not costing you ANY character space on your monthly contract. 

You either take the time to make your posts intelligible, or I'll delete them.  I'll take the time out of my day to spare the others that really look to help others - I'll delete your garbage so we can move on to more important topics - the ones that care enough to really say what they mean, or want.

Don't short-hand poop around here.  I personally can't stand seeing it, I won't try to figure out what you're trying to say, and I won't put others through it.  Use your brain instead of being lazy. 

If you don't like that - that's just too bad.