Sisco Posted July 31, 2014 Report Share Posted July 31, 2014 (edited) When Burris recently discontinued their first generation 4 x 12 laser range finding scope, I was able to pick one up at an affordable price. I had a time trying to decide which of my rifles to try it on first. I eventually decided on my Colt HBAR 5.56 for a couple of reasons: 1. This scope is HUGE, it would take away from the handiness of one of my carbines. 2. The bullet drop ballistics are based on rifle barrels, and the velocities found by using them, 3. I had recently developed a hand load specifically for this rifle, and wanted to blue print it's ballistic curvature. First a couple of observations: my shooting that day was a testament on why you should never drink four cups of coffee on an empty stomach and then go to the range. I went at spur of the moment, so the coffee had already been consumed. My groups were, to put it mildly, very disappointing. Also, this rifle made me appreciate how much I have been spoiled lately by Armalite 2 stage triggers. This one will be getting a Geissele when I can afford it. That said, below is a picture of the rifle with the scope and sun hood on it. Told you it was huge! Per manufacturers instructions I sighted in the scope at 100 yards with my hand loads: 21 gr Reloader 15, CCI small rifle primers, 75 gr Hornady BTHP Match bullets. No FTF or FTE, no signs of overpressure. Thanks Night Force for running that load on Quickload. Below is my sight in target, I am embarrassed to say. After getting zeroed in best I could, I started the process of programming the electonics. What the eliminator does, is take a laser distance reading that is picked up by the ballistic computer, which then calculates holdover, and one of 39 orange LED's light up indicating your holdover aiming point. You can see this in the reticle picture below: Burriss provides a list of the most common manufactured cartridges/bullet designs with the data to program in. As I was shooting hand loads, I had to find the closest approximation, which was Black Hills reloads with a 75 gr hollow point match bullet. As my experience with Black Hills ammo is that it is "lively" I opted for one notch below. The code for programing is first you put a "1" in, which stands for an original 100 yard zero. For longer distances you can also use a 200 yard zero with some cartridges,which gives you extra usable range on the aiming system, followed in this case by "60" , which is the bullet drop at 500 yards for this cartridge combination , for a programming number of "160". As I thought my reload would be milder, I put in "161". I turned out to be wrong. Below was my first target at 200 yards. Keep in mind I was not compensating for windage. I reprogrammed for "160" and below was my second target. As you can see, the scope does nothing to compensate for windage, which was blowing from left to right about ten miles per hour. On the Eliminator III, they have windage compensation dots as seen in the reticle picture below. Conclusion: The Eliminator, when properly programed for the right cartridge bullet combination, worked out to two hundred yards. My next effort will be to find a 500 yard range to explore it's accuracy limits. Because of its size and weight, 26 ounces, I don't really see a field use for it, except for a situation where you are in a blind shooting at distance targets at varying ranges, like Prairie dog shooting, or maybe stand shooting out west. You aren't going to want to carry it up and down mountains all day. As a training tool, to get better at distance estimation, and better at learning proper holdover for a specific rifle/cartridge combination, I think it will be very useful. I intend to use it that way with all my rifles, to see what the specific needs are for each one. It also already taught me I need to work on my ability to read and compensate for the wind. At the price I got it for, it was worthwhile. Edited August 1, 2014 by Sisco Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shibiwan Posted July 31, 2014 Report Share Posted July 31, 2014 Did you pick this up when it was on sale at Cabelas? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisco Posted July 31, 2014 Author Report Share Posted July 31, 2014 No, Midway, $504. Free shipping. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Microgunner Posted July 31, 2014 Report Share Posted July 31, 2014 What a cool scope. Any of those targets would've resulted in a kill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blue109 Posted July 31, 2014 Report Share Posted July 31, 2014 the scifi nerd in me loves this.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisco Posted July 31, 2014 Author Report Share Posted July 31, 2014 One other comment: the optical clarity is somewhat disappointing. It is ok, but not to compare to A Nikon Monarch, for instance, or a Leopold. I hope that Burris improves that on the Gen 3 models. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shibiwan Posted July 31, 2014 Report Share Posted July 31, 2014 (edited) Picked one up at Cabelas just as they started dumping them in June. Paid $599. I missed out on the Midway sale... should have picked up another for fun. Stuck it on top of the 300 BLK... looks out of place, like it came out of a sci-fi movie. <laughs> Edited July 31, 2014 by shibiwan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Microgunner Posted July 31, 2014 Report Share Posted July 31, 2014 I did a similar thing. I mounted an Elcan Digital Day/Night Hunter on my FN FS2000. The scope was a big as the rifle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shibiwan Posted July 31, 2014 Report Share Posted July 31, 2014 I did a similar thing. I mounted an Elcan Digital Day/Night Hunter on my FN FS2000. The scope was a big as the rifle. NICE! Gotta get one of those... or one of those new fangled ones that "fires" the weapon for you. The great thing about the eliminator is how the reticle "zooms" with the magnification so it's correct at different magnification factors. Virtual FFP scope. :D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Microgunner Posted July 31, 2014 Report Share Posted July 31, 2014 I didn't like the Elcan. Too big, too heavy, too battery hungry/dependent and too complex. Sold it. The FS2000 now wears a much more appropriate Redfield 4 reticle red dot sight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisco Posted July 31, 2014 Author Report Share Posted July 31, 2014 NICE! Gotta get one of those... or one of those new fangled ones that "fires" the weapon for you. The great thing about the eliminator is how the reticle "zooms" with the magnification so it's correct at different magnification factors. Virtual FFP scope. :D The reticle zooms, but the bullet compensator program only works at 12 x on the first generation eliminator. The Eliminator III it works at all magnifications. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisco Posted July 31, 2014 Author Report Share Posted July 31, 2014 Picked one up at Cabelas just as they started dumping them in June. Paid $599. I missed out on the Midway sale... should have picked up another for fun. Stuck it on top of the 300 BLK... looks out of place, like it came out of a sci-fi movie. <laughs> Missed that writeup. Something like this makes sense for the Blackout, also for the AR10 in 338 Federal. Bigger slow moving bullets are harder to calculate trajectories for. Something like this would take a lot of the guess work out of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unforgiven Posted July 31, 2014 Report Share Posted July 31, 2014 Brother Ron has that Elcan , that was bada$$. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shibiwan Posted July 31, 2014 Report Share Posted July 31, 2014 (edited) Missed that writeup. Something like this makes sense for the Blackout, also for the AR10 in 338 Federal. Bigger slow moving bullets are harder to calculate trajectories for. Something like this would take a lot of the guess work out of it. That was the idea, however execution is a different story. With supersonics (110-125gr), it was easy to set up because you can use 7.62x39mm ballistics (i.e. AK47 ballistics, using table 190). This requires a 100-yd zero. Everything is fine and dandy..... Switching to subsonics is where the issue lies. You can set it up for the correct drop etc, but the zero will be at 50 yards, so switching between supers and subs needs a re-zero unless you initially set up the supersonic data to zero at 50 yards. Not a show stopper, but it requires significantly more work to set up, and especially with the summer temps out here, I wasn't about to do all that walking back and forth measuring bullet drops etc. LOL Edited July 31, 2014 by shibiwan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisco Posted August 1, 2014 Author Report Share Posted August 1, 2014 (edited) That was the idea, however execution is a different story. With supersonics (110-125gr), it was easy to set up because you can use 7.62x39mm ballistics (i.e. AK47 ballistics, using table 190). This requires a 100-yd zero. Everything is fine and dandy..... Switching to subsonics is where the issue lies. You can set it up for the correct drop etc, but the zero will be at 50 yards, so switching between supers and subs needs a re-zero unless you initially set up the supersonic data to zero at 50 yards. Not a show stopper, but it requires significantly more work to set up, and especially with the summer temps out here, I wasn't about to do all that walking back and forth measuring bullet drops etc. LOL? Never thought of the subsonic issue with 300 Blackout. Edited August 1, 2014 by Sisco Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shibiwan Posted August 1, 2014 Report Share Posted August 1, 2014 (edited) The reticle zooms, but the bullet compensator program only works at 12 x on the first generation eliminator. The Eliminator III it works at all magnifications. Isn't yours the Eliminator II? That's what I picked up from the Cabela's sale. The only difference between the original Eliminator and the Eliminator II is the firmware between version 1.xx and 2.01 . Going to version 2.01 of the firmware will virtually "zoom" the reticle (see my other post) when you go from 4x to 12x. The lit dots actually "move" as you turn the zoom ring. You can check the firmware version when you first enter the setup mode and it displays the version as a number before showing the current set data table. The firmware update is supposedly available and can be done through the USB port under the battery cover. Not sure how you get the update but I think a call to Burris may prove to be useful. Let us know how it goes. :) Edited August 1, 2014 by shibiwan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisco Posted August 1, 2014 Author Report Share Posted August 1, 2014 Interesting! I will check that out. Thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Microgunner Posted August 1, 2014 Report Share Posted August 1, 2014 I did a similar thing. I mounted an Elcan Digital Day/Night Hunter on my FN FS2000. The scope was a big as the rifle. I didn't like the Elcan. Too big, too heavy, too battery hungry/dependent and too complex. Sold it. The FS2000 now wears a much more appropriate Redfield 4 reticle red dot sight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shibiwan Posted August 2, 2014 Report Share Posted August 2, 2014 Nice FS2000. I'd love to get a P90/PS90 sometime. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Microgunner Posted August 2, 2014 Report Share Posted August 2, 2014 Nice FS2000. I'd love to get a P90/PS90 sometime. We have a PS90 for sale. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blue109 Posted August 2, 2014 Report Share Posted August 2, 2014 if I hit the lotto id just buy 2 of everything FN makes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shibiwan Posted August 2, 2014 Report Share Posted August 2, 2014 We have a PS90 for sale. How much? Fai dorra? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edgecrusher Posted August 2, 2014 Report Share Posted August 2, 2014 ^^^^^ Awe shit! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Microgunner Posted August 2, 2014 Report Share Posted August 2, 2014 How much? Fai dorra? For a 308AR member...$900 + shipping. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted August 3, 2014 Report Share Posted August 3, 2014 (edited) How much? Fai dorra? NO FAI DORRA FO YOU!!! For a 308AR member...$900 + shipping. But $1100 for Shibi! Just kidding. I've been involved in the oriental bidding war in a past life, during many tours in Korea. They tell you how much, you go WAY LOW, and then it's EVEN MORE from them. <lmao> Edited August 3, 2014 by 98Z5V Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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