Jaywats01 Posted November 14, 2019 Report Share Posted November 14, 2019 Hey people, So I know this is going to sound crazy, but I'm looking to either buy or build an AR for around 700. Now I done some leg work, but do i try and build one or just buy a complete rifle from PSA or an equivalent? Any help or suggestions would be greatly appreciated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DNP Posted November 14, 2019 Report Share Posted November 14, 2019 Start planning like crazy and watch for. Black Friday sales. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belt Fed Posted November 14, 2019 Report Share Posted November 14, 2019 I'm partial to Diamondback rifles for the money. you can buy one for close to 700. all I know is they work. but you need to look around good to get a decent 308 in that range. think I give 750 for mine, the black ones were cheaper. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaywats01 Posted November 14, 2019 Author Report Share Posted November 14, 2019 29 minutes ago, DNP said: Start planning like crazy and watch for. Black Friday Yeah that's what I've been doing, seeing who and where sales will be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaywats01 Posted November 14, 2019 Author Report Share Posted November 14, 2019 10 minutes ago, Belt Fed said: I'm partial to Diamondback rifles for the money. you can buy one for close to 700. all I know is they work. but you need to look around good to get a decent 308 in that range. think I give 750 for mine, the black ones were cheaper. I like the look of the Diamondbacks, hoping they are going to have some good sales Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliff R Posted November 15, 2019 Report Share Posted November 15, 2019 I got an DPMS Oracle in a trade couple of years ago, NIB. Right out of the box the trigger was excellent, very slight "take-up" and light and crisp. I topped it with a 3.5-16 Burris scope and good mount and took it to the range. I also did the A-2 stock conversion (preferred on all my AR's). I put half a dozen different loads thru it and very few spread over an inch at 100 yards. It really liked one type of factory ammo, going from memory it was "Fusion" or something like that. With my 175 grain Barnes hand loads it did pretty good, but I still took my PSA 14.7" 308 to Colorado the past few years as it's just a tad lighter.....Cliff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magwa Posted November 15, 2019 Report Share Posted November 15, 2019 for the bucks I agree DPMS is hard to beat ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
392heminut Posted November 15, 2019 Report Share Posted November 15, 2019 3 minutes ago, Magwa said: for the bucks I agree DPMS is hard to beat ... I agree Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliff R Posted November 15, 2019 Report Share Posted November 15, 2019 (edited) I've logged about 150 rounds thru mine, and managed a couple of groups well under 1" with factory 150 grain hand loads, IMR 4320 and Sierra 150 grain soft points, and not one single failure to feed, eject, or any other issue of any kind. What amazed me was the trigger, most AR's have tons of take-up/creep, gritty and WAY too heavy for pull. This one is about as good as it gets without going to an aftermarket adjustable deal. I'd take it out West for a Fall hunting trip w/o hesitation...... Edited November 15, 2019 by Cliff R Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
COBrien Posted November 15, 2019 Report Share Posted November 15, 2019 (edited) I'm dumbfounded that this hasn't been said yet... STAY AWAY FROM PSA if you're buying something that's already assembled (i.e., complete lower, complete upper, or complete rifle). They still haven't figured out the issues they have, and continue sending out a cobbled-together mess of a rifle, which the end user has to immediately swap parts on just to get the thing to run. Manufacturers beta-testing products on consumers who generally don't know any better gets under my skin... I built a .308 AR for a friend for $1,000, all-in. This included a Ballistic Advantage barrel, Aero receivers, ToolCraft BCG, and some other parts that were midway up the price continuum. If a guy shops Black Friday and Cyber Monday sales online and is willing to drop down a notch or two on price, he could probably build something substantially similar in the $700-800 price range, and it would stand head-and-shoulders above ANY PA-10. Edited November 15, 2019 by COBrien Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaywats01 Posted November 15, 2019 Author Report Share Posted November 15, 2019 1 minute ago, COBrien said: I'm dumbfounded that this hasn't been said yet... STAY AWAY FROM PSA if you're buying something that's already assembled (i.e., complete lower, complete upper, or complete rifle). They still haven't figured out the issues they have, and continue sending out a cobbled-together mess of a rifle. I built a .308 AR for a friend for $1,000, all-in. This included a Ballistic Advantage barrel, Aero receivers, ToolCraft BCG, and some other parts that were midway up the price continuum. If a guy shops Black Friday and Cyber Monday sales online, he could probably build something substantially similar in the $700-800 price range, and it would stand head-and-shoulders above ANY PA-10. That is actually why I have been hesitant on buying from PSA, but with that said what sites would you recommend I go on to start looking? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
COBrien Posted November 15, 2019 Report Share Posted November 15, 2019 2 minutes ago, Jaywats01 said: That is actually why I have been hesitant on buying from PSA, but with that said what sites would you recommend I go on to start looking? https://www.armorally.com/ Generally has the best prices on Aero Precision and Ballistic Advantage parts. https://www.righttobear.com/ I've found some smoking deals on small parts (gas blocks, especially) here. https://www.opticsplanet.com/ Always has good prices, and all orders over $50 ship for free. Leave a review on a product you've purchased from them, and you get a coupon code for 7% off another order. PSA is also a good place to buy parts. If you sign up for their e-mail newsletter, they have Daily Deals and Weekly Deals that often can't be beat anywhere else. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRiverII Posted November 15, 2019 Report Share Posted November 15, 2019 Hold on a bit, we're not here to disparage huge concerns that may one day rectify issues. Some concerns are arming half the country, to me that's a big positive. If folks have issues, there are mighty smart, intelligent, and caring manufacturers, gunsmiths, and masters of the rifle right here and available to us for free. You can find a gold mine of info here, beware of the belligerent, dust snorting, hot breath, dragon ass beasts that appear. They will knock you off your journey if you are faint of heart. ( HINT ) Rub their tummies and they calm down, listen for the rumble that's where the best is located. Brother, 700 will go to 8 or 9 quick. You're already ready for rifle #2. Look at the 458 socom. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belt Fed Posted November 15, 2019 Report Share Posted November 15, 2019 55 minutes ago, RedRiverII said: beware of the belligerent, dust snorting, hot breath, dragon ass beasts that appear. That really hurted muh feelers red. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Belt Fed Posted November 15, 2019 Report Share Posted November 15, 2019 Whatever you choose, have fun with it. i'm leaving back for the woods in about an hour. this pic was taken on a rainy day and i'm too old to get soaked so I truck hunted.lol seen five cross but none I wanted to shoot. it's a diamondback 6.5 creedmore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
COBrien Posted November 15, 2019 Report Share Posted November 15, 2019 2 hours ago, RedRiverII said: Hold on a bit, we're not here to disparage huge concerns that may one day rectify issues. Some concerns are arming half the country, to me that's a big positive. If folks have issues, there are mighty smart, intelligent, and caring manufacturers, gunsmiths, and masters of the rifle right here and available to us for free. You can find a gold mine of info here, beware of the belligerent, dust snorting, hot breath, dragon ass beasts that appear. They will knock you off your journey if you are faint of heart. ( HINT ) Rub their tummies and they calm down, listen for the rumble that's where the best is located. Brother, 700 will go to 8 or 9 quick. You're already ready for rifle #2. Look at the 458 socom. PSA may very well rectify their issues. But they haven't yet, after how many years of peddling the PA-10? Look, PSA is a great place to buy a "cheap and cheerful" AR-15. Or parts for any AR-platform rifle. But I (personally, and most certainly not on behalf of the mods/admins at 308AR.com) will continue to discourage folks from spending hard-earned money on a PA-10 until PSA gets their sh¡t together. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliff R Posted November 15, 2019 Report Share Posted November 15, 2019 (edited) My out West 308 hunting rifle is from PSA, but I only used their stripped lower and 14.7" upper w/o the BCG. The lower got the A2 stock and a few parts from PSA as some of the parts in the lower kit I got elsewhere didn't work. The pins for one I believe were not the right length, maybe a couple other parts, been too long ago and I have bad cases of CRS these days. Performance from the barrel and upper has been solid to date. Can't remember where I sourced out the BCG, or the buffer and springs for the A2 stock, but I will say the weapons runs FLAWLESSLY and to date has never had a single failure to feed, eject, or any other issue anyplace. I purchased the PSA 308 stuff right when they first started getting into them, so basically just used their upper and lower to build from. After reading all the issues they have I may have dodged a bullet with that deal, no pun intended!........Cliff Edited November 15, 2019 by Cliff R Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted November 16, 2019 Report Share Posted November 16, 2019 11 hours ago, COBrien said: I'm dumbfounded that this hasn't been said yet... STAY AWAY FROM PSA I refrained from commenting, at all in this thread, for that very reason. Trust me, it wasn't easy... OP - if you buy a PSA, you'll spend money to get it right. Bare minimum you'll do will be replace the recoil system - complete - and drill up the barrel's gas port to the appropriate diameter. Figure the additional time, work, and money on parts, into the "budget cost" that you thought you got that rifle for... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRiverII Posted November 16, 2019 Report Share Posted November 16, 2019 What's a guy do for $700? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRiverII Posted November 16, 2019 Report Share Posted November 16, 2019 (edited) Before I entered this wonderful site I bought a PA-10 lower, then ordered an upper. Because I wanted to know more about the 308 I found this haven. OMG I smell the bull shite also, haven my patoot. Anyway I put the rig together at the range. I had the complement of buffers, springs and other parts ready to fix the challenges that arose. BTW I did get a 7" inner length buffer tube. I shot the 308, brass flew at 4 o'clock into a trash bucket the range had behind me. Every shot had the brass eject into that bucket. No, not every one, if I changed position they flew close to the bucket. Was I a lucky recipient of a PSA mistake, building an accurate and correct rifle? Maybe. Do I believe PSA has a bunch of lesser built rifles? Perhaps. I will not take a position on this other than say what my experience was. I have the 1095, I have the Heavy Buffer buffer, cryogenic ejector springs, anatomy lube and torture table. Once more, what's a guy do for $700? Edited November 16, 2019 by RedRiverII spelling Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted November 16, 2019 Report Share Posted November 16, 2019 19 minutes ago, RedRiverII said: What's a guy do for $700? You build a budget AR15 for $700. You don't build a working .308AR for $700 - and expect it to work. The cheapest WORKING .308ARs I've seen are easier to buy, than build, and that's the budget full-factory DPMS LR-308 guns, and the Armalite DEF-10. Both are a grand. $1k. Base rifle, iron sights. If you "budget" yourself to $700 on a .308AR, you're gonna get a shiit-gun that works on some ammo, some of the time, kicks like a pissed off mule, and has shiit for accuracy. That's my $0.02. The .308AR isn't a poor-man's hobby, you can't build it "cheap" and expect it to work right, all the time, with whatever ammo you find. It just doesn't happen. People try to cheap out often - and then they show up here, ultimately, pissed that their budget gun doesn't work right, and demanding help, most times, immediately. My answer for the $700-gun guys is usually - send it back and make them fix it. So, they send it back, and that "factory" tells them that it functioned fine, and there's nothing wrong with it. Again, after that - WE catch hell, here, for it. I didn't make the gun, machine the gun, design the gun... but I can tell you what that "factory" fucked up with that gun - if you give me the specs on it that I ask for... At that point, right there - you're spending more money on your "budget gun that was xxx dollars..." - just to get it running. This isn't AR15 land here. There are no reliable budget $700 guns in this world - that work right, right out of the box... Not for a .308AR... (Here come all the naysayers, talking shiit about their Davidson Defense gun that runs perfect...). <<< Bring that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRiverII Posted November 16, 2019 Report Share Posted November 16, 2019 Original OP, $700 is out of the question. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted November 16, 2019 Report Share Posted November 16, 2019 Budget guns have recoil systems that are trash, and gas systems that aren't even up to par for a working .308AR. Small gas ports, mostly (they choke down the available gas, to "compensate" for the weakass recoil system). Short gas tubes are the next thing that causes problems. Most common complaints are "It's over-gassed! I NEED an adjustable gas block!!!" read on, it's not even possible for it to be "over-gassed" when the gas port in that barrel is TOO SMALL to begin with... So, with a gas port that's too small, how the hell is it "over-gassed?!" It's NOT over-gassed - it's under-recoiled... THAT is the primary problem with all these "budget guns..." The .308AR needs a buffer that weighs 5.4oz, just to control the WEIGHT of the .308AR BCG (enough ASS for the MASS), and it needs a proper spring that will handle that 5.4oz buffer, BCG weight, AND the recoil energy of the .308 Win cartridge. SECONDARY to that, it needs a proper gas system that will cycle that action weight - and that means a proper gas port diameter, and gas tube length. Anything short of that is just "cheaping out" on a manufacturers part. 3.8oz buffers are WAY less expensive to make, than 5.4oz buffers - because tungsten costs money. 3.8oz buffers don't belong in .308AR guns, ever. If that manufacturer cheaps out once again, and uses AR15 carbine receiver extensions - buffers get MORE expensive for them, if they'd make them to the proper weight from the beginning. Using the 7.000" internal-depth AR15 carbine extension means that .308-makers have to use a 2.500" .308 carbine buffer... the only way to get THAT 2.500" thing to 5.4oz is to use a stainless body, instead of an aluminum body - and the two tungsten weights - and that's more $$$ for manufacturers. They just don't do it. They don't spend money on "budget guns" and those budget guns don't work right - because the manufacturer cheaped out - on YOU. The buyer. Build it right, or buy it right - those are your options. It's not happening, with decent-quality parts that work - for $700. Bring the naysayers... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cliff R Posted November 16, 2019 Report Share Posted November 16, 2019 I've built half a dozen of these weapons, all before finding this site. All function flawlessly even though for some of the parts I was wondering around in the dark a bit. Since I wasn't educating myself with the help of the experienced folks on here I have a nice box of leftover parts that don't fit or work well due to incompatibility issues between the various designs/offerings. The DPMS Oracle I got in a trade for a S & W handgun was straight out of the box from Rural King. Topped it with a top quality scope, rock solid mounts, A2 stock and supposedly the correct buffer/springs and it runs flawlessly, and accuracy is very acceptable and as good as the custom 308 AR's I build sourcing out components supposedly "higher end" from various on line sources. I am NOT "pushing" the Oracle, just pointing out that it's not too bad for the price point right out of the box although I never fired it with the collapsible stock that it showed up so not completely sure if that gas system would work as good as what I put in it?........Cliff Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magwa Posted November 17, 2019 Report Share Posted November 17, 2019 everyone here knows this rifle I started here on this site with it knowing nothing, I spent bucks to lighten the rifle but from the very start it has been a 1/2 moa rifle I have shot 5 elk numerous deer and killed a butt load of steel I paid 900.oo for it it was money well spent but now that the bastards here have spent all my money on suppressors and SBR,s and lord knows what is arriving in the mail tomorrow if I had it to do again I would build what I want to shoot for the purpose I had in mind.... both of these two elk were killed over 350 yards the gun works,,..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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