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survivalshop

Hunting with the 300BLK

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    Herre is one persons view on this .

HUNTING: .300 AAC BLACKOUT FOR DEER?

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This is a big question around the whitetail woods: how well can the AR-15 serve as a viable hunting rifle when chambered for this round? Here’s one answer… Read on!

300 blackout

SOURCE: NRA Publications, American Hunter
by Philip Massaro

The AR-15 platform has been modified and fiddled with for quite a while, and has its own series of cartridges designed specifically to function within the parameters of the rifle. The 6.8 SPC, the .458 SOCOM, the .50 Beowulf — all were built to give the AR-15 a different level of performance than the standard 5.56 NATO/.223 Rem.

There is also no doubt that .30-caliber cartridges are, have been, and probably will remain America’s favorite. So many cartridges have been modified to hold .30-caliber bullets that I have almost lost count. The .300 AAC Blackout is the cartridge built to function in the AR-15 platform, and with its design comes a different mindset, as the cartridge is called upon to fill a special role.

As a hunting cartridge, the .300 BLK certainly doesn’t look like one of the usual suspects: it is a stubby little guy, definitely lacking the look of a long-range cartridge. That’s fine, because the Blackout was never designed to fulfill that role. Perhaps a bit of history is warranted:

The Blackout’s roots are spread in the soil of the U.S. Military, which was looking for a round that would give better sub-sonic capabilities than their suppressed 9mm carbines, especially for close-in work. With some modification of a wildcat cartridge — namely the .300 Whisper — the .300 Blackout was delivered by Advanced Armament Corporation. The case itself can trace its roots all way back to the .222 Rem., through the .221 Fireball case also formed from that platform. It was designed to fit in a standard 5.56mm AR-15 magazine in double-stack configuration, yet use the long 220-grain .308 caliber bullets for subsonic performance. The Blackout did just that — pushing those 220-grain slugs at 1010 fps — but also did very well with the lighter bullets. That short case will push 125- and 130-grain bullets to a muzzle velocity of around 2200 fps — certainly no speed demon, but enough to get the job done on military targets. It functions perfectly through the AR platform, with one caveat: any ammunition that uses the sleeker-ogive bullets will actually chamber in the .223/5.56mm rifles, and that can pose one helluva problem should the ammo be confused. Please keep them separated!

In the the deer woods, the .300 AAC is an acceptable choice. If ranges are kept around 100 yards — much like the .30/30 WCF — things should go right for you. Were I using a Blackout on a deer hunt, I’d most definitely choose a premium hunting bullet in the 125- to 135-grain range, as they’ll produce the proper terminal ballistics. Those heavy 220-grain slugs are simply moving too slowly to give reliable expansion, and will more than likely whistle on through like a solid, resulting in a wounded or lost animal. No one wants that.

AAC deer rounds Author believes that, loaded with a suitable bullet, the .300 Blackout is suitable for use as an effective deer cartridge, as much so as are others with similar ballistics, such as .30/30 WCF.

Ammunition choices are pretty broad now. As said, you’ll want to keep your hunting distances within reason, and choose a bullet that will expand reliably at the furthest distance you expect to take an animal with the Blackout — the range where that bullet will slow down. I’m not one of those who gets hung up on energy figures — where the commonly accepted figure of 1,000 ft.-lbs. to kill a deer came from, I don’t know — but you definitely need reliable expansion in order to kill effectively. Looking at just a few, Hornady loads the 135-grain FTX bullet at a muzzle velocity of 2,085 fps, and this will make a great hunting round. They also load their 110-grain GMX — an all-copper, polymer-tipped bullet — that will also get the job done well, again, providing you use it within reasonable ranges. Barnes builds their VOR-TX Blackout ammo around the 120-grain monometal TAC-TX bullet; Barnes worked very hard to deliver a bullet that is plenty accurate and yet gives good expansion and penetration.

The whitetail deer has suffered from guinea-pig status; I know hunters who seriously use calibers ranging from .17 Rem. all the way up to the .450 No.2 Nitro Express to make their venison, with varying levels of success. The whitetail is so prolific that, like feral hogs, sportsman tend to experiment with varying calibers and bullet weights. A good bullet, like that GMX or TAC-TX, at the lighter .30-caliber weights, will get the job done, and that’s been pretty well proven. Considering the Blackout’s trajectory, you’ll want to limit the range to 100 or 125 yards. To obtain a 200-yard zero with the Hornady FTX load, you’ll need to be 5 inches high at 100, which is a bit drastic. Perhaps a 100-yard zero, or 1 inch high at 100, where you’d be in vitals at 125 yards, makes more sense.

So, is the Blackout the perfect deer cartridge? It’s no .308 Win., but I that within 100 yards it’s a better choice than any .22-caliber centerfire. The choice is up to you, but if I were handed an accurate Blackout for a hunt in the northeast woods, I wouldn’t hesitate to use it, provided it was loaded with a good, sensible bullet.

Check out AAC choices at Midsouth HERE

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I would say that I agree with him.  Especially on the 100 yard limitation for a full powered load.  I took this pig with a suppressed load at 65 yards.  208 gn Amax at 1056 fps.  But I put it in his ear.  A shot to the body cavity would not have dropped him.

IMG_8739.JPG

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I would say I agree with the article based on my research. I have never owned a .300 blackout but have looked into it a lot and I don't believe I would take a shot at a whitetail with it past 100 yards. But that's double what I would take at a whitetail with a good .223 hunting bullet. 

But here is something to spark some interest that I haven't seen many talk about. 

http://6mmar.com/30_ARX.php

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  I don't totally agree with the Article , but do believe the Cartridge has its limitations ( as with any other Cartridge ) Those of you using the Heavy sub ( or close ) sonic Loads may be missing something , take for instance the Barnes 110gr. Bullet , it is a proven Hog stopper with body shots as it is with Coyote's . 

  I would also use the 110 gr. for other light skinned north American Game  ( White Tailed Deer ) also , I guess I will have to get back into hunting to test these Loads out , including another Cartridge ,the 25-45 Sharpes with a 90 gr, bullet load .

  Hogs won't be hard to find here in Florida .

 

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I agree with the article generally, but at those ranges I can use a 12 gauge slug and that is the end of the conversation as far as stopping power.

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One thing I want to point out, white tails in the north are usually a lot bigger bodied than white tails in the south due to our colder climate. And not saying that the round can't kill at farther distances, a well placed .22LR can. personally I wouldn't use it past 100yards

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6 hours ago, survivalshop said:

 including another Cartridge ,the 25-45 Sharpes with a 90 gr, bullet load .

  Hogs won't be hard to find here in Florida .

 

That 90 SGK should put a hurt on them...  I'd love to see that.  :thumbup:

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4 hours ago, ARTrooper said:

One thing I want to point out, white tails in the north are usually a lot bigger bodied than white tails in the south due to our colder climate. And not saying that the round can't kill at farther distances, a well placed .22LR can. personally I wouldn't use it past 100yards

      I used to Hunt in Ohio & have taken some very large Deer with a 8 " bbl. , 44 Mag Handgun at 100 yards , one shot stoning with 200 gr. JHP , I would not think twice about shooting a Deer with the 300BLK at 200 yards or even more  , if I could use it up there , I would go up there for Gun season again , just to test it .

     I have some good sized Deer in my Back Yard , but they are like Pet's . Guys that I used to work with keep asking me to go to Georgia to Hunt with them , I may take them up on it this year , just to test these Calibers out . 

      I dont think you guys don't give this Cartridge enough credit . You can see my Chrono. results in this BLK Section .

      I absolutely cant wait to try out the 25-45 Sharps !  I'm going to make them both happen this year !  I miss Hunting any way :thumbup:

  

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I'm not trying to take credit away from the cartridge. I'm just sad about the one that got away from me with .243 with a 100 yard shot through both lungs. 

I have no doubt that 300blk could take deer at 200 yards, but it could be the one big tough son of a bambi's dad that gets away at far less than that with a very reasonable shot that I would hate. 

I do think it would be the perfect gun for thick woods and brush though.

Would love for you to prove me worries wrong in the field though. ;)

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7.62x39 puts down people at greater ranges than 200 yards, and 5.56 does as well.  300BLK is at least comparable, or better, than the x39, depending on what your projectile weight is.  I wouldn't even hesitate to take a shot at 600 yards on a human-sized target, or large animal, with a 5.56 - as long as it was a 1:7" or 1:8" twist, and some Mk262 ammo.  It would be even better with some Barnes 70gr TSX loaded up.  You get some light .30 cal TSX rounds loaded into a BLK case running supersonic, know your holds or scope drops, and it would be much more effective than the 5.56 referenced above. :thumbup:

ART...  load some of these babies up...

Barnes 85gr TSX for .243 Win...

5a51d36961f3d_Barnes243Win85TSX.thumb.png.283c0f4759fec409dc17a159ed9d0d95.png

Edited by 98Z5V

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Man sized target at 500 is no problem at all with 124gr 7.62x39.

 

.300 Whisper with 85-100-110-124gr should do better.

 

100 yard limit? y'all need to put some big boy pants on.

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I'm gonna say, man vs beast is two different things. One thing I was taught in the academy was that we see people get shot in movies and video games all the time and things are over exaggerated. Rounds making you fly backwards or instantly killing you. We see this so much that it transfers into our brains. So when a lot of people really do get shot, they act how they see it. Basically their perception of  what they think will happen causes it to happen, and the body and mind gives up. That's why we are taught to fight through it everything and never give up. 

Trooper Trevor Casper who died 2 and 1/2 years ago fought through it. He was shot in the neck, chest, and left hand; yet he still managed to take down the man who mortally wounded him. 

In Afghanistan, I saw an insurgent shot 15 times (actually hit that many times, not just shot at 15 times) with 5.56, and he was still running. Doubt he ever watched movies or played video games. The only thing he probably knew was fight hard and don't stop until he sees his 70 virgins. 

Now lets apply this to deer... yeah I don't think deer watch movies or play video games. All they know is survival and if they give up they are dead for sure. and not just from humans, but from wolves, mountain lions, and even other predators such as coyotes that I have seen wound deer.

Using my dad as an example, I have seen him shoot a deer 5 times with 220 grain .30-06 bullets. Don't jump on me for this, yeah I know, clean shots. My dad was always more of the just keep shooting type of guy. But anyways, after 4 shots to the body of this deer, it was still going. The 5th shot hit the spine and the deer was still going just dragging its back end. 

Now I think the rounds my dad were using were a bit overpowered for whitetails. But this past season opening morning I shot a doe at 60 yards with 160gr .30-60 rounds. One shot and she jumped up like she could fly and then ran over the hill where I couldn't see her about 100 yards away. 30 minutes later a small buck a little younger than the doe stood 20 feet from where I had shot the doe. Same broadside shot. One shot and he dropped like a rock, didn't even take a single step. What I noticed about the doe when I found her was, her chest cavity looked like mush. I even told my buddy that I wished he had brought a soup ladle. Heart was pulverized, lungs were demolished, and basically ever other vital organ was obliterated in her chest. Was the biggest mess and the most work I have ever had gutting a deer, AND SHE STILL RAN 100 YARDS! The little buck was the opposite. Though he dropped without a step, he was only lung shot through both lungs and everything was still pretty intact inside him. Now maybe there is more clinical of a reason between how the two deer reacted, but I have to say, I think the older doe just had more drive to survive unlike the younger buck who hadn't seen much life. I have noticed on several occasions that older ones just seem to put up more of a fight and go farther. And many of us have seen deer with old gunshot wounds or even broad heads still inside them.

So in summary of my rant: Deer and humans are two very different animals. The will to live is much stronger than most realize. And most rounds, whether it be .243, 300blk, 5.56, 7.62x39, 25-45 sharps, or most other hunting/home defense calibers will take deer (or whatever else) most of the time, but that small percentage when you shoot the monster and it gets away with a well placed shot, you might be seeing things my way. ;)

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    There are no thick woods, rifle , Pistol or Arrows out there , far too many variables . Also too many variables with gun shot or Arrow shot Deer to compare one to another . Yes, if a Deer is spooked already , it may or may not matter , they may be running away down hill , which will help them gain distance , where running up hill ( they almost never do when shot ) will decrease their running away distance .

   There is no magic bullet , yes some are better in just about every caliber , but its all about the individual circumstances of the shot & the Deer  .

    

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32 minutes ago, survivalshop said:

where running up hill ( they almost never do when shot )

I call bullpoopy. lol. off the top of my head, I can think of 8 deer I have shot that have ran up hill instead of taking the easy way downhill. I'm sure there are probably more. and I am not talking about some little Illinois flat landed hill. I'm talking about several hundred feet in elevation.

I claim this to be a myth

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Up or down isn't the key, they seem to have an uncanny knack of heading whichever way will make the pack out the hardest!

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18 hours ago, jtallen83 said:

Up or down isn't the key, they seem to have an uncanny knack of heading whichever way will make the pack out the hardest!

haha. that is the truth for sure. It's like they are thinking, I may be dyeing but I'm gonna make this hell for you. 

I'm already having the deer hunting dreams again. 

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I have quite a few 300 BLK rifles, one is set up for home defense with a red dot and the other three are se up for range duty. I do not hunt so all my reloads are with the Hornady 110 V or Z max bullets on top of IMR 4227. My HD rounds are the 115 Grain Barnes TAC-X loads (factory).

I shoot targets at 100 and 200 yard with my hand loads from the AR and the Ruger Ranch in 300 BLK they are accurate enough to be fun but will not win me any matches. With a 100 Yard zero I am 3 inches low at 200 (12 Clicks on my Nikon 3x9s). 

The Barnes load is zeroed for 100 yards and is 3.5 inches low at 15 yards which I feel is pretty reasonable for an HD set up a Center Mass shot is still going to be in the ball part of the vitals.

I have a friend in his late 70s that can no longer handle the recoil of full power rifle loads so I let him use my Ruger Ranch rifle to shoot. He told me with that little rifle and round he actually looks forward to shooting again.

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All the 300 Blk I have reloaded so far are not sutable hunting bullets, you have me interested enough I willload up some 125 -135 gr. Supersonics this spring and test them out. Trooper, for whatever reasons, I have found Wisconsin does will run longer after being shot than Bucks. I had one of those chest mush does run 100 yards then died in mid jump! The heart was practically vaporized.

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3 hours ago, dsdmmat said:

I have quite a few 300 BLK rifles, one is set up for home defense with a red dot and the other three are se up for range duty. I do not hunt so all my reloads are with the Hornady 110 V or Z max bullets on top of IMR 4227. My HD rounds are the 115 Grain Barnes TAC-X loads (factory).

I shoot targets at 100 and 200 yard with my hand loads from the AR and the Ruger Ranch in 300 BLK they are accurate enough to be fun but will not win me any matches. With a 100 Yard zero I am 3 inches low at 200 (12 Clicks on my Nikon 3x9s). 

The Barnes load is zeroed for 100 yards and is 3.5 inches low at 15 yards which I feel is pretty reasonable for an HD set up a Center Mass shot is still going to be in the ball part of the vitals.

I have a friend in his late 70s that can no longer handle the recoil of full power rifle loads so I let him use my Ruger Ranch rifle to shoot. He told me with that little rifle and round he actually looks forward to shooting again.

Sorry that would be 6 inches low at 200 for 1/4" click scope adjustments.

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2 hours ago, Sisco said:

All the 300 Blk I have reloaded so far are not sutable hunting bullets, you have me interested enough I willload up some 125 -135 gr. Supersonics this spring and test them out. Trooper, for whatever reasons, I have found Wisconsin does will run longer after being shot than Bucks. I had one of those chest mush does run 100 yards then died in mid jump! The heart was practically vaporized.

maybe it is because girls are more stubborn than guys. lol. 

I don't have a lot of experience with does, I can count the number of does I have shot on 1 hand. probably 80% or more of the antlerless deer I have shot have ended up being little nubbin bucks.

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I will have the opportunity next winter to do some serious pig hunting. I will probably use my AR 10, but in certain areas I may need to go suppressed due to multiple critter opportunities and/or development not that far away. so I am thinking of using my suppressed 300 Blk, but with a supersonic hunting load. Suggestions from you experienced pig hunters as to a good handload?

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On ‎1‎/‎5‎/‎2018 at 8:14 PM, NTXshooter said:

I would say that I agree with him.  Especially on the 100 yard limitation for a full powered load.  I took this pig with a suppressed load at 65 yards.  208 gn Amax at 1056 fps.  But I put it in his ear.  A shot to the body cavity would not have dropped him.

IMG_8739.JPG

Have some AMAX bot thinking more of Supersonic/expansion tip loads even though I will be suppressed.

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4 hours ago, Sisco said:

I will have the opportunity next winter to do some serious pig hunting. I will probably use my AR 10, but in certain areas I may need to go suppressed due to multiple critter opportunities and/or development not that far away. so I am thinking of using my suppressed 300 Blk, but with a supersonic hunting load. Suggestions from you experienced pig hunters as to a good handload?

110gr or 130gr Barnes TSX, brother.  That 110 would be a zinger, for sure.  Here's some load data from them.  I'll see if I can find more in the Barnes book, and get it in here.

http://www.barnesbullets.com/files/2016/03/300AACBlackoutV6ForWeb.pdf

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Thank you sir!

That 110 gr with H110 powder looks just the ticket. 2450 fps? Thats movin!

Edited by Sisco

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how quiet do you need  to be? is that can gonna make much difference at that rate? ive only tested the 150's to 220's..the 150 is loud enough for earpro advised? 

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