LR-308 Build #1

[DustBuster]

Hello All... I swore I wouldn’t post another thread, until I could shoot with my new Lr-308 a quarter sized group at 100 yards.  I did Not achieve this kind of Open sight group this last Sunday, but I want to share anyway of the results.  I went with a friend who has a Diamondback 308.  His Bolt definetely doesn’t slam as hard closed as mine, so I suspect he has a lighter buffer than my 5.3 KaK heavy buffer.  He thought my gun didn’t kick as hard as his, so this also could be from my heavy buffer.  My gas port is .91 + - according to Faxon, and my gas system is rifle with a Carbine buffer/tube   and spring.  I’m using a 1/4 longer gas tube so it protrudes at least halfway past the cam pin cutout.  I bore sighted my rifle (as shown in a different post) with a cheap airsoft laser and an improvised mount for it.  My first shot was 6 inches high at 35 yards slightly down hill, but DeadCenter Sideways. I was pleased with that result.  My groups at 35 yards on the average were about a fifty cent piece... with an occasional little flinch flyer.  Everything worked great, the bolt stop held after last rounds on each of my different magazines.  There were no jams.  I noticed I was ejecting at about 4:30 about 5-7 feet away.  A small dent on most brass is the only bothersome discovery.  I tried to adjust my gas block more open, to move my ejects towards 3 o’clock, but nothing seemed to happen.  I guess I was pretty much all the way open already.  I might try swapping with my friend and used his lighter buffer, just to see what would happen, or I’ve read about clipping ejector springs or using a little Velcro pad on the deflector.  I love the way it shoots, so I might just not change anything. I’ve seen comments by experts here saying they would reload brass that looked similarly dented small and Sharpish like my brass was.  My magpul bipod shows up today, so in the next couple of days I’ll will try to sight in by myself at 100 yards.  I think the front blade adjustments I did on the first shoot are pretty close.  I sent a little 4” square of wood flying with a first shot at 100 after the final elevation adjustment.

 

[DustBuster]

My Dented Brass

[DustBuster]

Target at 35 yards,

after a bit my friend shot at my target and I shot at his at the end so I really don’t know if all those little groups are mine but probably

[shooterrex]

At 35 yds you should be about 2" low. That high at 35 yds you might be shooting over the target at 100yds .

For iron sights you are doing good.

Remember to move the front sight opposite the direction you want the impact to move.

[392heminut]

14 hours ago, DustBuster said:

My Dented Brass

If that is all you got then reload it and don't worry about it! Most of us here have reloaded brass that was a LOT more buggered up than that!

[edgecrusher]

14 hours ago, DustBuster said:

My Dented Brass

That’s from your shell deflector. You can add weight to your buffer or cut back on your gas. If you do the latter, go back till it won’t lock open on empty then go one up so it will

[DustBuster]

In reply to all three of you guys;

shooterrex:  ok, yeah, I’m in trouble then, because my front sight post is nearly all the way up!  I have a Ruger Ol Army 45 BP pistol that I epoxied a nail Head on top of the blade and that thing shoots pretty accurate for the average ranges..might have to do that to these cheap sights.  My buddy had what appeared to be magpul sights and there was way less side slop in his, mine are pretty lame.  I will analyze an estimate .308 trajectory and try to sight in for about a 150yd Zero soon.

392heminut: yeah, I won’t worry about the brass.  The primers are scarce, it be very hard for me to have my pops part with 100 more. I now have about 200 factory loads and 120 reloads using once fired brass.  A jug and a third of powder for this rifle, but it’s no good unless I steal more primers from my Dad.  I might try reducing gas just out of curiosity of what changes.

edgecrusher, I will try doing what you say for the heck of it... I’ll leave the buffer for now the same, until I shoot again with that dude, I’ll swap then with him just to see.

thanks guys for tips...bipod is on now so I can probably hit the shooting spot and really try to stay precise and see if I can be accurate.  I definitely didn’t do very good on breaking in this barrel, I only cleaned it once after the first shot, then shot 16 more.  Maybe it doesn’t matter from what I’ve read.

[DNP]

You didn’t get a really good deal on Amazon or eBay for those sights did you?

[DustBuster]

1 minute ago, DNP said:

You didn’t get a really good deal on Amazon or eBay for those sights did you?

No, I got a cheap set from Mentium USA, and they will do for a while... 36 for the pair or something like that.  Maybe when Magpulls Gen3 sights come out I will upgrade.  I’m not a ballistician by any means, but I plugged some data into a calc site and assuming my sights are actually 2” above bore line, 35-50 yards is close to the first zero if my goal is 150 yards.  I think that will be a realistic sight in zero for open sights possibly hunting antelope in the future.  Anything farther than that and I should get a scope on it.

 

[DustBuster]

According to the chart above, 25-35 yards will be about 3/4 below line of sight.

i plugged a block of wood at 100 yards.. and my last little test group was at my friends target at 35 yards... at least a couple of the shots were mine near his main bullseye.  Sure enough, they look like they are 3/4” low.... my sights might be set close to a 150 Yard zero.  Later shooting will tell me more.

[DustBuster]

I just measured my sight height, it’s 2.71”.

that changed Everything!  I need a chronograph and some consistent groups before I can “predict” my far zero based on a close target.  I might be closer to a 200 Yard zero.  I will stop guessing and as someone here has told me, just shoot the damn gun.

So, to turn the topic to future Builds... What would be the best caliber for a 308 receiver?  I have looked at ammo availability for 6.5 creedmore and .243 and I pretty much do not want to ever buy rounds for those...insane prices on 243.  Too bad.  Guess reloading is a must with a hefty primer supply if one wants one of those wildcats

[DNP]

Good news on the sights. I was going to warn that there are a lot of air soft knockoffs out there that are pretty much garbage. If you see MBUS sights at a price too good to be true...it really is. 

[shooterrex]

Before the stupidity started Hornady American Gunner 6.5 creedmoor was about $140 for 200 rnds. My rifle shoots those really well. Right now everything in that caliber is almost $3.00 a round. I expect it to come back down some eventually. If I could find powder and primers I would reload my brass.

[Tack14]

Dustbuster hold on to that brass, maybe times will not always be bad for finding primers.  But those dings will very likely be smoothed out almost entirely by the resizing die.  My M14 puts a diagonally shaped ding in almost the same spot as it bounces off the hump on the op rod (which is there by design for this very purpose) which is prety much same place, just a bit lower, and I got/get that ding in about the same spot every time whether it was factory ammo or "final tuned" handloads.

The process of the brass going through the sizing die will help "pop back out" those dings somewhat, and the rest will come back out the next time you fire that round, it will fire-form to your chamber.

Just keep an eye on things and look out for signs of thin case walls etc.  Any reloading manual worth its salt should have example pictures of signs of case wear, case head separation etc. to watch for. 

This is one advantage of re-using military brass if you can find some that isn't waaaaaay too oversize from the MG's they were fired from.  It is thicker and in my experience with the old '14 it can usually take being resized and reused a few more times.

Congratulations with your build it looks like you are getting there with the sight in's.

 

[DustBuster]

Thanks you guys... for the helpful wisdom.  Tack14, I put some electrical tape on the deflector about 4 layers and the dent/crease is almost not visible.  I have some LC brass that is going to be reloaded next, so I’ll be safe and sound but will keep an eye out for dangerous brass signs.  

DNP, Judging by today’s sight in, I absolutely hate these sights and who knows, maybe they are Airsoft pieces of crap!  I definetely did not use good fundamentals today shooting at 100, shame on me, but I don’t have super confidence in these sights now.  The target bullseye was pretty hard to see with these targets. I will buy the black and neon green kind next. I didn’t break in my barrel properly so I’ll probably throw a scope on and see if I can shoot as well as my 30-06 does. 

shooterrex thank you too.  Your right, I should be shooting lower at 30 to not fly super high at 100, and I was that first day I shot.  I brought my POimpact down a lot already.  Roger on 6.5 info... I’m debating on buying an Upper before Sleepy J makes it stupidly hard.  

 

Here is what Day2 brought.  

Shooting 4 PMC and 4 Handloads at 100, 

2 PMC and 2 Handloads at 30 yards.  I left the sights as they were.  I have a lot of improvement to make.

[jtallen83]

15 minutes ago, DustBuster said:

I’m debating on buying an Upper before Sleepy J makes it stupidly hard.  

I love a good debate, what can I say to talk you into getting that done yesterday?................. Really, 401K, IRA, new rifle, chances look pretty equal for not holding on to any of it very long on the current course, just well get something fun 

[DustBuster]

37 minutes ago, jtallen83 said:

I love a good debate, what can I say to talk you into getting that done yesterday?................. Really, 401K, IRA, new rifle, chances look pretty equal for not holding on to any of it very long on the current course, just well get something fun 

Yeah... I was all set to buy one just because I Can still... what held me up is the Forward assist location was Just behind the shell deflecter.  (DPMS low profile style?). In comparison there are Forward assists farther to the rear of some receivers.. and I take it that those are (DPMS high profile...Eg: Aeros). The different looks and the way one doesn’t need a notched bolt and the other maybe just barely helps assist by an 1/8”, stalled me on a purchase.  I kinda want a forward assist for hunting reasons, but in hindsight, I shoulda put it on this 308 and not any future smaller caliber build.  If only we all would have bought stock in the primer companies...or Charmin... Ridiculous!

[Tack14]

Yeah the KAK uppers I got have the forward assist more to the rear and are DPMS high.

 

That's a good idea on covering what the brass bounces off of with something.  I saw some pics of a build someone did one time that, aside from all the other reasons it caught my eye (the ODG/black color scheme for example), was that they had used some time of a textured rubber material that evidently had some type of adhesive backing on it.  They cut a small piece perfectly shaped to the shell deflector face on the  upper, and another just the perfect size of the raised center hump on the dust cover.  I thought those were really neat ideas.

I'm sorry I should have mentioned that yesterday I totally forgot.  Definitely nothing wrong with preventing the dings to your brass in the first place!

[DustBuster]

Ok Tack14, I remembered your build used a KaK upper... I guess your rifle is doing fine being a high rail...I’m sure it was a bit harder to find a handguard to fit, during these times, but I assume there are plenty of companies making them...I could get a matching color slickside upper to my spare lower or get a Black KaK or Black low profile upper from another company.  I’m sure the rearward forward assists work better, but dont know.  Guess the 60 or 90 day bullcrap comment period for stupid gun redefinitions is still going on.  I don’t want to go through federal bullcrap for an upper.  I’ll wait for awhile but may wait too long.

Im researching scope mounts now, might settle with a cheaper Leupold one... one review on Amazon of Aero ultra lite 1” offset one piece mount had me pause.... The guy said it was not a very good fit to the tube diameter...I need to a decent but cheaper item... I’ve blown so much doe.  I’m planning on putting a 4x Weaver k4 on it that I have on my 17hmr.  I love the fact that my new 308 looks cool and simple  with iron sights but I can’t hit diddly with these cheap ones and maybe not even with good ones.  I want to see how good this barrel of mine is with the help of a scope. Thanks for info... I run on and on and on

Edited April 30, 2021 by DustBuster

[Tack14]

Larue Tactical makes some good mounts, all different kinds, I have a few of them and they're definitely "no BS".  They get a good bite on the rail but if adjusted right they won't chew it up. 

https://www.larue.com/category/larue-mounts/scope-mounts/

 

Another I looked at some years back is PRI / Precision Reflex. 

https://precisionreflex.com

They make some pretty serious boltgun mounts and make really heavy duty rings all different sizes too.  I haven't looked at them in a  while but back years ago they were cheaper than some of the usual suspects.  Leupold always scared me away with their pricing too.

 

[DustBuster]

14 hours ago, Tack14 said:

Larue Tactical makes some good mounts, all different kinds, I have a few of them and they're definitely "no BS".  They get a good bite on the rail but if adjusted right they won't chew it up.

Ok Tack14, appreciate the news....  I was hoping for some advice on the rings...but I jumped the gun already.  I saw shooterrex’s post of his marvelous shooting Space CAnnon, and zoomed in on his photo.  I noticed not a one piece mount but two separate rings.  That got me to thinking..”hmm, why have an extra chunk of metal in between the two rings, when my gun already has a big ridge of metal there.  Economy actually persuaded me more and I at first bought some Burris xtr non-signature rings, but canceled that order when I found out how heavy they were 8oz.  Then I got to looking at Warne rings and bought a pair on eBay for 70 bucks.  1.4” height and 6oz.  The one piece mounts can even be lighter than that, but then I’d be spending quite a bit of dollars.

The Larue CANs would have been awesome, but 200 bucks and possibly wait for a year made me hesitate.  Some day maybe I’ll upgrade scopes and QR mounts and sights... I saved the web page of Precision Reflex, looks like some good stuff there, tnx.

[shooterrex]

Warne makes great rings.

[98Z5V]

17 minutes ago, shooterrex said:

Warne makes great rings.

Indeed, they do.  I run the Warne Maxima steel rings on all my bolt guns. 

26 minutes ago, DustBuster said:

I saw shooterrex’s post of his marvelous shooting Space CAnnon, and zoomed in on his photo.  I noticed not a one piece mount but two separate rings.  That got me to thinking..”hmm, why have an extra chunk of metal in between the two rings, when my gun already has a big ridge of metal there.  Economy actually persuaded me more

Economy always "persuades you more" - because you're so tight that your piss comes out in spray. 

This is why any information from me - to you - has dried up.  Gone. 

You're cheap as fornicate, always looking for a buck, and don't know what you're doing in the first place.  You don't listen to advice, and you cheap-out after some lameass excuse. 

In the long run, your cheap-ass will screw you on the proper parts, you'll argue it, and still not be right.  Then STILL get on here and whine about your gun function, or your scope function, or your actual shooting abilities - that you'll blame on equipment.  ...That you found on Amazon or Ebay.  For a few bucks cheaper. 

 

Edited May 2, 2021 by 98Z5V

[dpete]

On 4/30/2021 at 10:47 AM, Tack14 said:

Yeah the KAK uppers I got have the forward assist more to the rear and are DPMS high.

 

That's a good idea on covering what the brass bounces off of with something.  I saw some pics of a build someone did one time that, aside from all the other reasons it caught my eye (the ODG/black color scheme for example), was that they had used some time of a textured rubber material that evidently had some type of adhesive backing on it.  They cut a small piece perfectly shaped to the shell deflector face on the  upper, and another just the perfect size of the raised center hump on the dust cover.  I thought those were really neat ideas.

I'm sorry I should have mentioned that yesterday I totally forgot.  Definitely nothing wrong with preventing the dings to your brass in the first place!

^^ This right here.  A small piece of self adhesive velcro available at any hardware store.  Might cost you fifty cents for 6 rifles worth.  Peel the hooked section off the fuzzy section and throw the hooked piece away.  Cut the fuzzy piece to fit the front of the shell deflector so it doesn't interfere with the dust cover opening up and stick it on.

 

This is on my 300 BLK and it ended the dented case mouths 300's are notorious for.  I've added these to every AR I own.  No more dented cases and it didn't affect ejection at all.

 

[DustBuster]

I bought a cheaper handgaurd and a set of crappy sights and a cheap ar-stoner sling..... ohhhh my Loooordy, I am the fool of the century.  I do read and look at everybody’s input 98 including yours, sometimes I don’t copy exactly that doesn’t make me arguementative, just free thinking no big deal.   So far my gun seems to be functioning great.  I’ve got a better trigger on the way.  I need lots of practice but I suppose that sin is forgivable.  For now a set of rings will probably work for both the scopes I have.  I’ll start by putting the 4x Weaver old scope I inherited from my Dad onto it.  When I upgrade scopes, maybe after saving for a while because I need a truck eventually ( my engine blew catostrophically ). Maybe I put low octane fuel in it.... don’t know. I was hauling a boat over a very steep grade in MT and had a Stupid Stupid oil changing kid double gasket my filter weeks before.  I had only driven a mile to my house when all of the oil had disappeared and the engine knocked bad... Found out the error but maybe damage had occurred.  It sounded good for two weeks then Whaam... no more cylinder.

On the future I might either buy a good set of iron sights or a top quality scope.

Good Day Gentlemen, I think this thread has run its course