Roadblock Posted October 11, 2018 Report Share Posted October 11, 2018 (edited) Yeah, so I finally got my 18" SS Target Match barrel from Armalite. I paid the extra $25.00 for the black Cerakote finish. Was raining the day I went to the range. Guys from West Michigan Cerakote said it's not Cerakoted. I knew it when I saw it too, the gas block land and the barrel threads were all black too, the whole barrel was. The Cerakoted one listed online was cleared coated with the gas block land and the threads covered so the coating didn't mess with the clearances. This was like poorly phosphate coated or melonite coated. My DD Mk18 got wet too, never seen anything like this. Side note, was shooting MEN16 German ammo. Edited October 11, 2018 by Roadblock Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
COBrien Posted October 11, 2018 Report Share Posted October 11, 2018 ^^THAT is clearly a stainless barrel that's been Cerakoted (taken directly from Armalite's website...). I'd be on the horn with Armalite (like, now) about a partial refund -- you paid for SS w/ coating and got phosphate. And now you're going to be out more for a good Cerakote job. Of course, you bear some responsibility here, too. Let's be honest, you knew it wasn't coated when you put it together. Should have called, gotten an RA#, and sent it back or asked for a partial refund at that time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
308kiwi Posted October 11, 2018 Report Share Posted October 11, 2018 28 minutes ago, Roadblock said: Side note, was shooting MEN16 German ammo. That's some really nice ammo, scored a 1200rnd tin of it a while ago, wish I could find more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadblock Posted October 11, 2018 Author Report Share Posted October 11, 2018 1 hour ago, COBrien said: ^^THAT is clearly a stainless barrel that's been Cerakoted (taken directly from Armalite's website...). I'd be on the horn with Armalite (like, now) about a partial refund -- you paid for SS w/ coating and got phosphate. And now you're going to be out more for a good Cerakote job. Of course, you bear some responsibility here, too. Let's be honest, you knew it wasn't coated when you put it together. Should have called, gotten an RA#, and sent it back or asked for a partial refund at that time. I've never owned anything with Cerakote on it so I did not know but my speculation was that since Cerakote is basically painted and this was applied to the threads and gas block area too, it was probably not Cerakote. I honestly did not care about Cerakote, I just wanted black, not raw Stainless. If it was sold as SS w/ Phosphate coating, I would have still bought it. The issue is those spots that are appearing out of nowhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
COBrien Posted October 11, 2018 Report Share Posted October 11, 2018 51 minutes ago, Roadblock said: I've never owned anything with Cerakote on it so I did not know but my speculation was that since Cerakote is basically painted and this was applied to the threads and gas block area too, it was probably not Cerakote. I honestly did not care about Cerakote, I just wanted black, not raw Stainless. If it was sold as SS w/ Phosphate coating, I would have still bought it. The issue is those spots that are appearing out of nowhere. Just to be clear, I wasn't meaning to accuse or belittle you in my post. I guess that was just the attorney in me coming out... I'd call Armalite and ask for a refund of the difference between what you ordered (and paid for...) and what you received. That would help cover the cost of actually having your barrel Cerakoted. A good Cerakote applicator will also sand/bead/media blast your barrel before application, which has the added benefit of removing that corrosion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadblock Posted October 11, 2018 Author Report Share Posted October 11, 2018 I did not take any offense to it! No worries! I didn't mean to snap back either. I spoke with a local friend who is a machinist and he said the spots are not rust. He said the surface of the barrel was not prepped properly before it was phosphate coated and the contaminates leaked out the of metal pours when the barrel got heated up and the water caused them to corrode which in turn ruined the finish. We were able to clean it off with Hoppes and an oily rag but you can tell where the finish is damaged still. I also spoke with Armalite, they said I got the wrong barrel in the mail. It should have been stainless with Black Cerakote. They have 3 stainless barrels, all 18", the Target Match is raw SS or black Cerakote and this is just the plain black Phosphate one. They are sending me a replacement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
survivalshop Posted October 12, 2018 Report Share Posted October 12, 2018 Did the Barrel come with that A2 type Flash Hider ? , Because it looks rusted , Just because its Stainless doesn't mean it will not rust , but I agree , bad finish & or prep . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted October 12, 2018 Report Share Posted October 12, 2018 2 hours ago, survivalshop said: Did the Barrel come with that A2 type Flash Hider ? , Because it looks rusted , Just because its Stainless doesn't mean it will not rust , but I agree , bad finish & or prep . Exactly. Stainless just means it will "stain... less..." Stainless can rust. Cerakote in threads or on barrel gas port diameters isn't a big deal, unless it gets put on there HEAVY. Cerakote goes on at 5/10-thou thick. That's 0.0005". I spray alot of the heat-cure Cerakote, and I don't even mask things off anymore - it doesn't make a difference if I do, or not. Paint lowers, and trigger and hammer pins still fit. That kinda stuff. Now, I've never seen Cerakote do what your barrel is doing. I've seen it discolor, on a suppressor, though. Nothing like what you're showing in that pic, though, no way. I'd ask them what type of Cerakote they applied, and send them that pic... There's an Air-Dry Cerakote (C-Series) and a Heat-Cured Cerakote (H-Series). The C is better for high-temp applications (headers, suppressors, etc), but the H is tougher for abrasions and general abuse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadblock Posted October 12, 2018 Author Report Share Posted October 12, 2018 2 hours ago, survivalshop said: Did the Barrel come with that A2 type Flash Hider ? , Because it looks rusted , Just because its Stainless doesn't mean it will not rust , but I agree , bad finish & or prep . No but it's factory. I literally bought JUST the barrel to go on my existing Armalite AR-10. I reused my old A2 which was already dinged up. The barrel was factory new a few days ago. 23 minutes ago, 98Z5V said: Exactly. Stainless just means it will "stain... less..." Stainless can rust. Cerakote in threads or on barrel gas port diameters isn't a big deal, unless it gets put on there HEAVY. Cerakote goes on at 5/10-thou thick. That's 0.0005". I spray alot of the heat-cure Cerakote, and I don't even mask things off anymore - it doesn't make a difference if I do, or not. Paint lowers, and trigger and hammer pins still fit. That kinda stuff. Now, I've never seen Cerakote do what your barrel is doing. I've seen it discolor, on a suppressor, though. Nothing like what you're showing in that pic, though, no way. I'd ask them what type of Cerakote they applied, and send them that pic... There's an Air-Dry Cerakote (C-Series) and a Heat-Cured Cerakote (H-Series). The C is better for high-temp applications (headers, suppressors, etc), but the H is tougher for abrasions and general abuse. Yes I'm aware that "Stainless" will rust BUT this should not have gotten finish spots on it after getting damp. I own many AR's with Phosphate coated barrels, I hike with them in the rain, I shoot with them in the rain and I do not dry them off right away, they never rust on the finish like this or get corrosion. It's just bad prep work. Either way Armalite did acknowledge that this was a Phosphate barrel based on the picture and it should absolutely have been Cerakoted, they Cerekote in their custom shop. They are replacing it so I'm happy! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted October 12, 2018 Report Share Posted October 12, 2018 That's good news, man. Damn good news. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisco Posted October 12, 2018 Report Share Posted October 12, 2018 I am watching this thread with interest. I am curious how Armalite’s quality control is holding up, and it sounds like that phosphate coated barrel has some issues anyway.with the quality of the coating and prep. Hope this isn’t becoming more common. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted October 12, 2018 Report Share Posted October 12, 2018 Same here. I've salt-water-swam phosphated barrels in a past life, and they don't rust right away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jtallen83 Posted October 12, 2018 Report Share Posted October 12, 2018 7 hours ago, Sisco said: I am watching this thread with interest. I am curious how Armalite’s quality control is holding up, and it sounds like that phosphate coated barrel has some issues anyway.with the quality of the coating and prep. Hope this isn’t becoming more common. It was nice to hear they are taking care of the issue without a hassle. Not so good to see that issue on their finish,never seen phosphate rust that easily, even hot blue I did myself holds up better than that! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted October 13, 2018 Report Share Posted October 13, 2018 On the note of Armalite, I've been waiting for AR-10 Carbine and AR-10 Rifle gas tubes to show up in stock somewhere. I called them this morning. They're literally 5 blocks from my last job location. I told the guy i need two Carbine and one Rifle gas tube, so he put me on hold for about 5 minutes, and rounded them up for me. I asked if they had a retail counter at the location, and they don't. He did take my billing, shipping and payment information over the phone, and he held them for me there. Drove up at lunch, and picked them up. VERY cool. The guy I spoke to was Cody. I'll tell you - the building for SAC isn't even marked on the outside. Nothing. Heavy tint on all the front glass, and you can't see inside, from outside. When they opened the door and let me in... It's IMPRESSIVE. It really makes you think, when you see the names on the wall... Strategic Armory Corporation, McMillan Rifles, Surgeon Rifles, AWC Silencers, Armalite, Nexus Ammunition... There's alot of talent under that roof... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rsquared Posted October 13, 2018 Report Share Posted October 13, 2018 That's good to hear brother. I've been worried about my beloved Armalite for some time now. Hopefully, they're getting back on track. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted October 14, 2018 Report Share Posted October 14, 2018 They are, slowly - the location is 100% manufacturing. EVERYTHING is made there. They're getting up to speed on running the whole operation from that location. It's gonna take time, because they're busy "making" all those brands. It was impressive, and I was only in the lobby, chatting with a guy that opened the door - until Cody brought my gas tubes up. This is why people need to call them - just pick up the phone and talk to humans there. These days, people think "direct communication" is posting something on their FB or Instagram page... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DNP Posted October 14, 2018 Report Share Posted October 14, 2018 Well, with the speed of responses on forums such as this one....who needs to make a phone call? We're here anytime you need us. Just not today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadblock Posted December 6, 2018 Author Report Share Posted December 6, 2018 (edited) And...... This still hasn't actually been resolved completely, more like 75% or so! It's been a hell of a rollercoaster though. Been thinking about a 6.5CM upper for Coyote but I don't know if I want to stick with Armalite OR try something else. Edited December 6, 2018 by Roadblock Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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