medic83 Posted April 16, 2013 Report Share Posted April 16, 2013 (edited) Just joined. I have a couple AR-15's that I built and I have been wanting to build a 308 for a while. I pulled the trigger and ordered a matched upper and Lower set from SI-Defense. I looked at a bunch of different brands and settled on the SI-Defense. I knew that the 308 was a whole different beast than building the 5.56. So Im here in hopes to get some opinions and suggestions on parts. Hopefully some reviews on your experiences as well. My goals... build a long range rifle but still pick it up and shoot it. But mainly long range. I was able to get alot done this last weekend at the show in Reno. Heres what I got so far.... SI-Defense upper- used DPMS parts to complete it (door, spring, etc) DPMS charging handle with Badger tac handle. SI-Defense Lower- DPMS LPK ( standard trigger). OD Green Ergo grip Magpul PRS butt stock (OD Green)....DPMS buffer, tube, and spring. Parts to order still.... Complete bolt assem. ( was gonna go with the SI-D nickel boron one) Thoughts?? 2 stage trigger or not??.... Im lost! So many to choose from. I got standard triggers on the AR-15's. Barrel---- going with 20".... from what Ive read, thats perfect for what my goals are. I like this one and its in stock... Id get the grey bead blasted finish not the shinny. Also threaded end. http://www.fulton-armory.com/barrelfatitan20nmhbarss1x12936gasblock.aspx Full length gas tube and Low pro gas block and full float handguard/rail. I really dont want a quad rail. Only putting a bi pod, Magpul AFG on it. No need for the bling Glass--- Vortex PST 6 x 24 Milrad ffp. Trying to place the order for the BCG, and barrel this week. Pretty sure thats most of it for now. Any input, opinions, or suggestions are appreciated. Thanks in advance! Edited May 27, 2013 by medic83 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edgecrusher Posted April 16, 2013 Report Share Posted April 16, 2013 Welcome to the forum! Fulton carries fantastic barrels, but if it were me I'd wait for a 1-10 twist. A little better for the heavy bullets. BTW, their 18.5" will be good for long range shooting, I'm not quite sure what your goals are. The SI-d bolt assembly will be fine. Two stage trigger? Fuck yes! I really like Geisselle. For what you are talking about building, SSA or SSA-E. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
medic83 Posted April 16, 2013 Author Report Share Posted April 16, 2013 (edited) 18.5 huh?? Ive read so much poop about barrels.... Some people say that an 18 is gonna be the best... then others say different. I felt that the 20" is the happy medium. I want this to be a 1000 yard rifle/ multi purpose. I was looking at a RRA 20" that was chrome lined, 1:10 twist. It was a much lighter barrel tho. I know with the 1:10 Ill have more precision ammo options. Are you mainly saying go shorter or try to find a 20"barrel with 1:10 twist? SI-D bolt carrier... have you heard anything about them? I like things to match... I figured that SI-D upper and lower with SI-D BCG would be the best match. I could be wrong tho..THx Edited April 16, 2013 by medic83 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edgecrusher Posted April 16, 2013 Report Share Posted April 16, 2013 I would say if you can shoot 1000yds, an 18" will do it. A 20" may be a bit better, but not so much if you can do your part. A lot goes into shooting that far, and if you can do it, the 18" will do it for you. I'm will not tell you stay shorter. It would be easier to lug around, but you need to be happy with it. My biggest thing for you is 1-10. After that, you need to figure out what you will want. I hope it helps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
medic83 Posted April 16, 2013 Author Report Share Posted April 16, 2013 Anyone else have suggestions for barrels?? I really want to stick with a 20". What are your thoughts on a muzzle break vs no muzzle break? Thx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
planeflyer21 Posted April 16, 2013 Report Share Posted April 16, 2013 Welcome medic83! I prefer 2-stage triggers also. A good 2-stage is good juju for me. Jon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edgecrusher Posted April 16, 2013 Report Share Posted April 16, 2013 Anyone else have suggestions for barrels?? I really want to stick with a 20". What are your thoughts on a muzzle break vs no muzzle break? Thx I did not say not to get a 20", I just said an 18" can get it done. Yes to a brake. Period. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unforgiven Posted April 16, 2013 Report Share Posted April 16, 2013 Welcome from Indiana brother medic.Jon and I both have a RRA with a 20" HBAR damn nice rifle.I just added a battle comp to mine.Great product also use it on 5.56. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rsquared Posted April 17, 2013 Report Share Posted April 17, 2013 Welcome aboard Medic. Yep like Edge was saying. Muzzle brakes, some buffer work, maybe an adjustable block (if that's your thing). You'll have that thing shootin smooth. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted April 17, 2013 Report Share Posted April 17, 2013 2 stage trigger or not??.... Im lost! So many to choose from. I got standard triggers on the AR-15's. Barrel---- going with 20".... from what Ive read, thats perfect for what my goals are. I like this one and its in stock... Id get the grey bead blasted finish not the shinny. Also threaded end. http://www.fulton-armory.com/barrelfatitan20nmhbarss1x12936gasblock.aspx Yes, 2-stage trigger. Don't know what your goals are, but sounds like longer distance, precision. A standard trigger sucks for that. That arena is where a good, light, 2-stage shines. The Fulton 18.5" stainless, medium weight barrel with a 1:10 twist will do a metric poop-ton better at longer distances than the barrel you listed/linked. You need heavy bullets to go distance. Heavy bullets are long. You need a fast twist to stabilize a longer bullet (the projectile). The 18.5" sounds like it will better suit your needs, if I have your needs correct. Don't get all wrapped around the axle about barrel length. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
medic83 Posted April 17, 2013 Author Report Share Posted April 17, 2013 Just called SI-D today. Ordered the Nickel boron BCG. Ordered it unassembled so it will ship out today! Gonna order the barrel as soon as I figure out wtf to get. I guess I am stuck on the length. I want 1:10 but I can't find one in a 20". I want to reach out to a 1000 yards. I guess that's why I was stuck on the 20". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted April 17, 2013 Report Share Posted April 17, 2013 You're all jacked up over this barrel-length thing, ain't ya? Calculate your velocity loss for the 1.5" of barrel you'd be giving up, with the 18.5" instead of the 20". You'll be shocked - it's not much. Now, figure out what max weighted projectile a 1:12 twist will stabilize, and do the same for a 1:10. You need HEAVY projectiles to get accurate at 1k yards, man. Get over the barrel-length thing you've got going on... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edgecrusher Posted April 17, 2013 Report Share Posted April 17, 2013 Get over the barrel-length thing you've got going on... ^^^^ This is what I've been trying to say guy. You are seriously only going to loose 150fps. That's it. You as a shooter will make more of a difference Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robocop1051 Posted April 17, 2013 Report Share Posted April 17, 2013 (edited) ^^^^ This is what I've been trying to say guy. You are seriously only going to loose 150fps. That's it. You as a shooter will make more of a difference 98 and Edge are right. The 18.5" vs 20" is less than a 100 fps difference. From 18" to 20" you really only gain 50-60 fps per barrel inch. So your debate is over a measly 75-90 fps?!? After 20" the gain in speed drops to about 40fps per barrel inch and after 22" the gain in speed drops to about 30fps per barrel inch. If you shot a Sierra Match HPBT 168gr out of a 20" barrel, you'd likely achieve a muzzel velocity of approximately 2,650-2700 fps. That same bullet in a 18.5" barrel will travel about 2,575-2,625 fps. This is especially true with the 1:10 twist stainless steel barrels. The high pressure barrels really secure muzzle velocity. You want accuracy? Remember the analogy of breaking a bunch of sticks vs breaking one stick? In that same thought, think of breaking a stick in half, then breaking it in half again, and again, and again. Everytime you break the stick it gets harder and harder to do. Barrel harmonics are the same. If you have two barrels of matching thickness, contour and design, yet one is longer than the other... The shorter barrel will be more rigid when shot. The longer barrel will slightly vibrate more, causing a difference in the barrel harmonics. The purpose of a bull barrel is to make longer barrels more rigid. An 18.5" barrel is inherently more accurate than a 20" barrel of matching statistics. For a 20" barrel to surpass the 18.5" barrel in accuracy, it must be considerably thicker and heavier. Faster bullets don't necessarily mean more accurate. Edited April 17, 2013 by Robocop1051 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
medic83 Posted April 18, 2013 Author Report Share Posted April 18, 2013 Thanks for your suggestions guys, placed the order for the 18.5". Great info! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
medic83 Posted April 23, 2013 Author Report Share Posted April 23, 2013 Bolt carrier came today. There is a couple of things I noticed. There is a couple of tiny nicks. I noticed some machining marks as well. Very minor but I'm wondering if I need to send it back. Will these things make a difference? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edgecrusher Posted April 23, 2013 Report Share Posted April 23, 2013 How about some pics Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted April 23, 2013 Report Share Posted April 23, 2013 Yep, need to see what surfaces the nicks are at... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goofball310 Posted April 23, 2013 Report Share Posted April 23, 2013 Shooting out to 1000 yards and being accurate out to 1000 yards are 2 completely different things. If you're looking to build a tack driver then most off the shelf barrels won't work as they aren't designed to shoot accurately past 500-700 yards. 90% of all AR's (AR-10 & AR-15) shoot 1.5-2.0 minutes which is no where near accurate enough for 1000yards. When you're trying to make consistant hits out to 1000 yards you really want put a lot of thought and emphasis on the barrel and BCG and your goal for 100 yards should be a .5 minute. As for barrel length, 18" or 20" really comes down to the build of the barrel. Give me a 21" Noveske or 20" GAP, SACS, or Larue barrel and they'll outshoot just about any off the shelf 18" barrel out there. Now, 3 out the 4 companies I just listed aren't offering 7.62 barrels anymore for resale and most custom barrel builders have extended wait periods, and a premium price usually north of $500. On that note, an 18" barrel is naturally more rigid and "should be" more accurate. Couple of bullet points 2 stage trigger (an absolute must in long distance accurate shooting) free floated rail/handguard (Mega's MKM upper is similar in design to Larue's OBR as the rail never comes in contact with the barrel nut) Muzzle brakes are not necessary but reduce felt recoil and provide easier follow up shots 20MOA scope mount/rings/base And unless you're familiar with shooting long range you might want to start reading on it because you'll have to calculate Range Temperature Barometric pressure Spin drift Wind input Cant Inclination Coriolis Effect Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
medic83 Posted April 23, 2013 Author Report Share Posted April 23, 2013 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
medic83 Posted April 23, 2013 Author Report Share Posted April 23, 2013 I dont think these will be an issue, and I know from using the mill that there will be marks unless they are smoothed out. Just trying to get your guys' opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EasyEJL Posted April 23, 2013 Report Share Posted April 23, 2013 where did you get that one from? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
medic83 Posted April 23, 2013 Author Report Share Posted April 23, 2013 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
medic83 Posted April 23, 2013 Author Report Share Posted April 23, 2013 where did you get that one from? SI-Defense Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
medic83 Posted April 23, 2013 Author Report Share Posted April 23, 2013 Honestly the bolt looks very nice. I just took a very close look at it and noticed some imperfections. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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