AR-Tenner Posted October 22, 2017 Report Share Posted October 22, 2017 Hi Folks, I am looking for the best chrome silicon spring out there for my ArmaLite AR-10A4 with 20" barrel and rifle-length receiver extension/A2 stock. I know the ArmaLite one is good, but it is made out of stainless steel and therefore can take a set and become unreliable after a few thousand rounds. I have been running a Tubbs chrome-silicon flat-wire buffer spring in this rifle for 7 years with excellent performance, but Tubbs doesn't make their springs from chrome silicon anymore, and I also have learned that flat-wire springs put a LOT more stress on the buffer detent when you remove the buffer and spring from the receiver extension than round-wire springs do, and I am hoping to move to a round-wire spring. It seems that in the 8 years I have had my ArmaLite, everyone has gone to only caring about collapsible stock weapons, and while Springco makes a spring for .308 AR platforms, their RED spring is only for carbine receiver extensions, and I am not interested in "tweaking recipes." I only want a spring that is specifically designed for a .308 AR with a rifle length receiver extension, and well-made of chrome silicon. The only item I have found that may match this is this one: https://www.bangswitchparts.com/products/ar10/buffer-spring-lr-308-rifle-chrome-silicon/ However, the suspiciously-low price and fact that they don't list a manufacturer makes me a little wary of this one. Does anyone have experience with it? I look forward to hearing what folks think are the best (if one does exist) options for a chrome silicon round-wire buffer spring for a properly-gassed 20" AR-10 with a rifle-length receiver extension. Thanks in advance! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shepp Posted October 22, 2017 Report Share Posted October 22, 2017 Welcome to the forum feel free to tell us about yourself in the intro section Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted October 23, 2017 Report Share Posted October 23, 2017 5 hours ago, AR-Tenner said: and I also have learned that flat-wire springs put a LOT more stress on the buffer detent when you remove the buffer and spring from the receiver extension than round-wire springs do, Wondering where you got that info from. Sounds impossible. If the buffer and spring are removed from the receiver extension, they are placing zero pressure or stress on the buffer detent. Maybe I'm not understanding what you're trying to state. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
washguy Posted October 23, 2017 Report Share Posted October 23, 2017 (edited) AR t welcome to the forum ! Here ya go https://www.bangswitchparts.com/products/ar10/buffer-spring-lr-308-rifle-chrome-silicon/ yes it comes from the same place you linked....buy the MoFo and come back in 7 years and report on its performance but if it were me I would use a Tubbs...I don't think you're going to miss anything just cause its not chrome silicon....you have run out of $hit to do Wash Ar t Why do you or want to keep pulling the spring and buffer out of the tube in the first place? If your that anal about the spring rubbing against the detent...take the stock off and let everything slide backwards never putting tension on the detent...but that is just nutz in the first place...what you need to do is build sumthin else to relieve your anal tension.....yeah lets build sumthin ! Edited October 23, 2017 by washguy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robocop1051 Posted October 23, 2017 Report Share Posted October 23, 2017 A braver man... a ground breaker... a pioneer... would invest in a Geissele 42 braided spring, install a spacer to reduce the internal depth of the rifle length receiver extension, and modify parts as needed, to run on a .308 platform. It it could be done, but will require patience. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
washguy Posted October 23, 2017 Report Share Posted October 23, 2017 3 hours ago, 98Z5V said: Wondering where you got that info from. Sounds impossible. If the buffer and spring are removed from the receiver extension, they are placing zero pressure or stress on the buffer detent. Maybe I'm not understanding what you're trying to state. 98Z here ya go ...our new member explained the deal with the spring detent in another forum more better http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?201015-Chrome-Silicon-308-AR-Buffer-Spring-for-Rifle-Length-A2-Receiver-Extension Wash Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted October 23, 2017 Report Share Posted October 23, 2017 (edited) 2 hours ago, washguy said: 98Z here ya go ...our new member explained the deal with the spring detent in another forum more better http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?201015-Chrome-Silicon-308-AR-Buffer-Spring-for-Rifle-Length-A2-Receiver-Extension Wash He also made the same post on ARF... Seems like all the detailed info went to ARF and M4C, but that's alright. I think he's the only one having this issue with a Tubb Flatwire spring. Edited October 23, 2017 by 98Z5V Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robocop1051 Posted October 23, 2017 Report Share Posted October 23, 2017 I’ve had a Tubb CS Flat spring and a 10 oz buffer for almost 7 years. No damage. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edgecrusher Posted October 23, 2017 Report Share Posted October 23, 2017 I have had no issues with my Armalite springs in an of my ar’s. The all have been built with them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Magwa Posted October 23, 2017 Report Share Posted October 23, 2017 Not sure of the answer you want BUT if it takes thousands of round to Maybe put a set in the spring you have just get another one because you are a rich man if you can wear out a buffer spring at todays 308 ammo prices, and it sounds like the one you have is working well.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bubbas4570 Posted October 24, 2017 Report Share Posted October 24, 2017 21 hours ago, Magwa said: Not sure of the answer you want BUT if it takes thousands of round to Maybe put a set in the spring you have just get another one because you are a rich man if you can wear out a buffer spring at todays 308 ammo prices, and it sounds like the one you have is working well.... What he said^^^^^^ Or if you just have to have a new spring, call these guys.....http://apfarmory.com The spring and buffer system they put into my fixed stock 308AR has worked flawlessly since I received it from them....16" barrel and rifle length gas system. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted October 25, 2017 Report Share Posted October 25, 2017 On 10/23/2017 at 5:45 AM, edgecrusher said: I have had no issues with my Armalite springs in an of my ar’s. The all have been built with them. Hear hear. Just installed a "new" one tonight - brand new purchased, brand new manufactured EA1095 spring. We'll beat the shiit out of it in a few weeks and see how it does. Bring lots of .308 Win ammo, brothers, and we'll try to kill it. And keep a round count. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robocop1051 Posted October 25, 2017 Report Share Posted October 25, 2017 2 hours ago, 98Z5V said: Hear hear. Just installed a "new" one tonight - brand new purchased, brand new manufactured EA1095 spring. We'll beat the shiit out of it in a few weeks and see how it does. Bring lots of .308 Win ammo, brothers, and we'll try to kill it. And keep a round count. You’re going to make me want a shorty .308 now. You SOB. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted October 26, 2017 Report Share Posted October 26, 2017 20 hours ago, Robocop1051 said: You’re going to make me want a shorty .308 now. You SOB. I'm gonna have to strip search you, like in 2012 - when you tried to get away with my Kimber Ultra RCP... This is one sexy little bastard, right here, brother. I'm gonna like this one. I'm not shooting it until you guys get here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted October 26, 2017 Report Share Posted October 26, 2017 (edited) You know what, Rob? You're gonna be the first guy to pull the trigger on it, on a live round. Then, we tune that brake. Edited October 26, 2017 by 98Z5V Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
COBrien Posted October 26, 2017 Report Share Posted October 26, 2017 (edited) I have no issues with the ArmaLite spring in my LR-308T (spring and buffer from Slash...), but if you must have a round-wire spring that's not made by ArmaLite, here you go: http://www.fulton-armory.com/bufferspringtitanrifle-1.aspx Also, it is my understanding that springs don't "take a set" just from being kept collapsed. It's the repeated cycling of a spring that causes them to lose tension. If your OEM spring has gone weak, buy a new spring... Edited October 26, 2017 by COBrien Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sisco Posted October 26, 2017 Report Share Posted October 26, 2017 (edited) With two thousand rounds on my AR10A4 20" rifle length fixed stock I have had no issues related to the buffer spring. I would replace with the same one from Armalite if I did.Tech can sometimes be for tech's sake. Edited October 26, 2017 by Sisco Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robocop1051 Posted October 26, 2017 Report Share Posted October 26, 2017 12 hours ago, 98Z5V said: You know what, Rob? You're gonna be the first guy to pull the trigger on it, on a live round. Then, we tune that brake. I accept Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bfoosh006 Posted October 27, 2017 Report Share Posted October 27, 2017 (edited) I actually spoke to David Tubbs today about this. Please do not read anymore into Mr. Tubbs comments then his response to the OP's original post. Here is his e-mailed response... 1. Questions the possible quality of the retaining pin.. and no offense, but it may be faulty... NOTE this is my version of Mr. Tubbs comment.... strictly to keep any possibility of offending any one to a minimum. 2. Yes the Flatwire is more difficuolt to install 3. The Flatwire has nothing to do with buffer position or the rear of the bolt position. And if the buffer hits the detent when the bolt is closed then some of the energy involved with closing the bolt will be transferred to the detent. 4. Pretty quick to condemn the Flatwire for tolerance issues beyond the control of the spring. 5. While Chrome silicon might be a slightly better spring material it’s not a milspec material (it will rust) 6. As far as the life of the spring there is insignificant difference between the Chrome Silicon and the 17-7 in the AR buffer tube environment. 7. A Flatwire spring is a better mousetrap when used in an AR buffer. David Tubb Take this anyway you want... AGAIN >>> NO offense to anyone. And I am just trying to give David Tubbs a fair shake in these comments. As for the OP... I hear what you are saying... but I will continue to use Tubbs springs and actually prefer them greatly over other ones. Edited October 27, 2017 by bfoosh006 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bfoosh006 Posted October 27, 2017 Report Share Posted October 27, 2017 (edited) Again ... AR-Tenner...I posted this in a respectful nature, so please do not take it as confrontational in nature. Added , because the internet cannot convey intent very well. Edited October 27, 2017 by bfoosh006 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
washguy Posted October 27, 2017 Report Share Posted October 27, 2017 7 minutes ago, bfoosh006 said: Again ... AR-Tenner...I posted this in a respectful nature, so please do not take it as confrontational in nature. Added , because the internet cannot convey intent very well. BF you are a fine member here....so not to worry about someone taking your hard work the wrong way....As for me...I said it once and ill say it again Ar-tenner is pretty much anal and has run out of $hit to do ........ The Tubbs is a great upgrade for one thing...no matter what its made of...and seven years of use with no problem... well duh I would prolly get another even if its made out of coat hanger wire....as for putting pressure on the detent when pulling the spring out or putting it in....leave it alone for God's sake... Wash Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted October 28, 2017 Report Share Posted October 28, 2017 4 hours ago, bfoosh006 said: And if the buffer hits the detent when the bolt is closed then some of the energy involved with closing the bolt will be transferred to the detent. If the buffer hits the detent when the bolt is closed, you have out-of-spec receivers. Most commonly, the buffer retainer hole was machined too far forward. When this happens, the buffer retainer will chew the shiit out of your buffer face. David Tubb knew this, and created the carrier weight system (Tubb CWS) in a manner to solve this issue, as well as add weight to the carrier. It's a true "Dual-Role" system. The Tubb CWS not only adds weight to the carrier, to affect bolt unlocking speed, it adds 0.080" to the back of the carrier length - thus fixing out-of-spec receivers that beat up buffer faces. Unfortunately, Tubb no longer makes the CWS (so I've heard), and you can't buy it anymore. If this is in fact true, I'm going to start making my own inserts for BCGs, that will stop the buffer/buffer retainer contact, when the receivers are closed. Here's some examples of a buffer retainer hole that's machined too far forward - and your buffer slams the retainer. This is not right, and is a machining problem. When the receivers are closed (then pinned), the back of the BCG pushes the buffer OFF the retainer. And the buffer never makes contact with the retainer, ever, during the cycling of the weapons platform - until you open the receivers again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted October 28, 2017 Report Share Posted October 28, 2017 (edited) I have one perfect example of this, in my own arsenal, happening to me - on a very expensive billet receiver set, from a very well known manufacturer. They machined the shiit wrong. Buffer retainer hole in the lower was machined too far forward. I caught it early enough, with my chewed-a$s buffer face, installed a Tubb CWS, and the problem never got a chance to do anymore damage. Problem solved; problem stayin' solved. I'll provide pics if necessary, but I won't name the manufacturer publicly. Edited October 28, 2017 by 98Z5V Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edgecrusher Posted October 28, 2017 Report Share Posted October 28, 2017 Makes me glad I have two CWS. Just in case Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bfoosh006 Posted October 28, 2017 Report Share Posted October 28, 2017 The CWS helped show / teach me how "tolerant" a AR platform can be ( prior to all the assorted buffer weights availability ) ... I have tried numerous VERY heavy BCG,CWS, buffer combos... right up to the point of the spent cases pile up at your feet. I wish Tubbs still made them... they are far more convenient then changing buffers for demonstration purposes at the range. You get peoples attention easier when you can just plop a part in and show how a heavier buffer ( added mass ) can change the cyclic action and recoil I'm pulse of an AR. I gotta say... I bought 4 spares when they were on clearance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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