Another problem - Many hunters are against "Assault Weapons"

[imschur]

Unfortunately there are many hunters who are not firearm enthusiasts. They too do not understand the platform and believe what they are fed by the media and politicians.

I recall sitting in this little diner/gas station/laundromat/video rental place "The Tamarac" in the north country of New York's Adirondacks. There was a group of hunters just back from the hunt discussing that "nobody needs those things". The fact that a  Remington 7400 and Browning BAR's is equal to or more powerful and functionally equivalent to an AR15 is beyond their grasp.

Some of this is also a generation gap. Some older shooters Ive spoken with not only see no need for an AR15 they are also opposed the carrying a handgun for protection.

We may all share a love for firearms but we are also divided and thats not good.

[98Z5V]

It'll be decades before the current (then, future) hunters are the ones that prefer semi-auto AR-type hunting rigs.  That's about how long it will take for the last 11 years-worth of combat veterans to be classified as "older hunters." 

Right now, it's an age-game, amongst the hunting community.  I'd like to see the age polls of people that think this way.

[unforgiven]

There were a couple of eposodes on G&A T.V. where the guys said something to the effect that don't hate me cause I carry an AR.United we stand Divided we fall.

[imschur]

When I was a kid my best friend across the street "Ben" was from a very strong hunting family. In fact his grandfather worked at Orvis, sort of a fly fishing instructor to the stars. Bens father was responsible for getting me (us) to shoot competitively in a .22 youth league. As we got older his dad took us trap and skeet shooting regularly. Then we turned 21 and it was time for our pistol permits. His old man as not too kind (behind my back) Stating that only cowards needed to carry a gun. I thought it odd but hey whatever. Then I got my colt Sporter. Holy cow you would think I brought home the anti christ. His dad never did warm to handguns or the AR's. Ben and I eventually parted ways

It's funny I come from from a family of hunters though I never really adopted the passion. Nobody in my family said one thing or another about my firearm choices and lifestyle. Dad never steered me towards anything, never gave an opinion.

Side story:

The person most responsible for my interest in guns was a family friend "Bud" who worked for the FBI. My parents referred to him  as a treasury agent.  Bud had something to do with the firearm manufacturers here in CT. He was always bringing me collectables from his visits. A lot of tie tacks and pins. Eventually even parts like raw stocks for projects. Bud had big plans for me. Sadly he died before anything came to be. The other person was our local police chief. I still recall  him taking me to the local sport shop and helping me pick a holster.

Funny how times have changed.

[seasprite]

There were a couple of eposodes on G&A T.V. where the guys said something to the effect that don't hate me cause I carry an AR.United we stand Divided we fall.

Yep I remember something like that the host said if you showed up with an AR you ridiculed and made fun of.

When I told some of my friends I was going to take my LR308 this year they looked like I farted and said you need 20 rounds to take a deer. I told them my lever holds 6  and I seem to always come home with 5 so this time it would be the same since MO has capacity restriction. Everybody thinks your going to do a mag dump or go full auto on them. Just sick of the stereo type but I know those of that hunt with these fine rifles know better. 

[98Z5V]

Critter hunters don't have that mentality.  P-dogs, javelina, coyote.  "Traditional" hunters, of the older variety, don't understand semi's.

[unforgiven]

I started by lurking on AR15.com,got a great deal on Coyote.Found you guys and never looked back.I feel I have done enough homework [you can really never do enough] that for what I need I have quality firearms.Good enough to put down anything in North America 2 legs or 4. <thumbsup>  And I still learn something everyday here from my brothers. 8)

[edgecrusher]

Some of this is also a generation gap. Some older shooters Ive spoken with not only see no need for an AR15 they are also opposed the carrying a handgun for protection.

This is so true. My father gives me a hard time for carrying. Says there has never been a need for him to in his fifty something years blah blah blah….and that he's is fine with whatever wrench is handy or anything else he can find at the time.

To this I rebut one thing.. back in the day you would get followed home if you were pulled over after having a few drinks, but what would happen now? Times have changed and never be stuck with a wrench in a gun fight.

Not to mention that he had two boys as a father and the odds back then of us being abducted were fewer (if believed naively) than me having a daughter stuffed into a windowless van.

[Matt.Cross]

Times are changing, and people don't like change. I think the very fact that you've seen camo ARs hitting the shelves in Sporting Goods stores for the last 5 years lends itself to the suggestion that minds are changing about this amongst the recreational shooting community. However, a big ship turns slow, and the majority of the hunting population is probably above the median of about 40 years of age.

[planeflyer21]

Remember Jim Zumbo?  His totally getting slammed over his anti-AR comments a few years back helped to change a lot of opinions out there.  And Ted Nugent rescuing his ass.

Tom has it right about being generational but it is also a locale thing.  Older hunters in this area are commonly carrying M-1 Carbines for javelina hunting and would carry M-1 Garands or M1As if it weren't for the weight.  Go back to Pennsylvania and semi-autos are NOT hunt legal (or didn't used to be).

Anyone you encounter with the attitude of "I don't need an assault weapon," just remind them that a few years ago the politicos were after "Scoped sniper-type weapons, that fire bullet-proof vest defeating ammunition."  In other words, every single bolt-action centerfire rifle in production.

First it will be "assault weapons", then "military and police style scoped sniper rifles", then "trench-warfare shotguns", then "cowboy range war lever-actions".

ZERO COMPROMISE!!!

Jon

[Magwa]

I grew up with a gun in my hands at age 10 I got my first shotgun a JCHiggens single shot 410 and I was allowed to roam the local woods and shoot quail,squirrels, and rabbits but I had to shuck walnuts for shell money but the best lesson I ever had was my mother who is Native would fix for us whatever i managed to get and instilled in me that if i kill it we will eat it .

  Well needless to say I have hunted all my life ,my children grew up teething on bear meat and elk jerky. Elk and deer have and still are the staples of meat at our home along with fish,I got my first colt AR 15 in 1974 was a fun gun to shoot and i loaded for it but it had no practical purpose for me in the hunting world to small for elk.. flash forward to last year the LR308 that i picked up I took elk hunting this year and it is the very best gun I have ever had in the woods of the pacific northwest rain does not effect it like a blued gun, no wood to swell and chip or break, easy to clean, very easy to carry a lot of options there,weight is comparable to bolt guns with 24 inch barrels. but what i love most of all is the simplicity I am a old school hunter and depend on hunting for my family I am not a trophy hunter and I think the AR platform is the best thing since sliced bread, I just wished I would have gotten into it  a long time ago..... and I took a elk with it this year and could have shot many deer with it but it is just the wife and I now and a elk gives us what we need...

[392heminut]

My oldest son, who spent 12 years in the Army, is now living in Alaska. He has all sorts of guns and hunts a lot. He has never owned an AR type rifle and I've been preaching to him for years to get one. It's not that he has anything against the platform (he has shot the crap out of mine whenever he's home) he has just kept putting it off. He called me yesterday wanting any advice I could give him on purchasing one now. Seems the frenzy has opened his eyes and he now thinks he better get one while he still can. My advice was "If you can find one locally and have the money get it NOW, not tomorrow. Tomorrow it will be gone!"

Magwa, thumbs up on your attitude on hunting! Other than predators I've never hunted for anything I didn't intend to eat, and have always consumed what I've killed. I've never been a trophy hunter. A friend of mine has a ranch up in central New Mexico gave me an open invitation to hunt elk at his place, as he gets several permits every year. I told him I had no interest in a rack, but would love to put some elk in the freezer. Couldn't do it this year but next year I will for sure!

[blue109]

Two guys at work...both long time Hunters..have been on the fence for the last year about ARs. One went to the "prepper" convention we recently had and it helped him make up his mind. I convinced him to snag one of those TROY guns from dicks. The other guy just called me this morning to tell me he wanted one but can only find $1200 bushies local. Told him at this point he can either over pay...or roll the dice and risk missing out.

[SPBCTS]

I'm 54, my exposure to guns started with Dad's bolt action hunting rifles. When I was 12, after walking with him as his, "spotter" the year before, I went to hunter safety school and after graduating he bought me my first rifle.

A Remington 788 in .243. It came with a 4 power fixed scope. He paid $99 for it.

It is hard for people who've grown up and lived in a world with one set of values to accept that change has come, and it isn't necessarily good change.

There was a time when men settled differences with their fists, and then moved on...sometimes they even shook hands after and had a beer.

Those times have changed.

Now...a man expecting to have a frank conversation or at worst that fist fight might find himself walking bare handed into a bullet.

That change is awful hard for decent people to accept.

The WWII and Korea Vets came back to love the M-14's and M-1's and some of the bolt guns.

Those weapons served them well and they respect them.

There is a next generation who've come to be fond of the black rifle.

It is going to be up to those of us who are fond of it to gently educate those who don't understand it. They don't take kindly to being talked down to, and they have a right to our respect. Starting with the point that we, as 2nd Amendment supporters, shouldn't allow a line to be drawn between us because of a misguided understanding of what the black rifle is.

And isn't

Then show them, explain it, be patient and respectful, and see if they can change. Point out that one semiautomatic rifle doesn't differ in actual function from their precious semiauto deer rifles or bird guns.

I just hope that the form of the rifle won't be big enough to drive a wedge between us.

Because those who seek to kill the second amendment in little bits at a time will make big hay of it...and continue their march.

[blue109]

great post. that should be shared around. <thumbsup>

[MaDuce]

Not every hunter has a brain in his skull. Far from it. I've actually had one brag to me that he unloaded a 12 gauge riot shotgun on a squirrel that still got away. It's not hard to imagine someone like that supporting some parts of the anti-gun debate.

[Matt.Cross]

The point made about veterans was a very good one, I never stopped to think about what memories and thoughts are attached to an M16-style rifle for a veteran. Makes it a little easier to understand their sentiment.

[planeflyer21]

Forgot about that prepper show!  Didn't find out about it until like Thursday that week.

True about Vets and what they were issued.  Those 'Nam era men ain't too fond of ARs.  ;D

I was sold on M1A/M14 styles, in part from listening to old Vets.  Then someone got me onto AR15s.  They were cool but they weren't .308.

Now...here we are.

Jon

[MaDuce]

Forgot about that prepper show!  Didn't find out about it until like Thursday that week.

True about Vets and what they were issued.  Those 'Nam era men ain't too fond of ARs.  ;D

I was sold on M1A/M14 styles, in part from listening to old Vets.  Then someone got me onto AR15s.  They were cool but they weren't .308.

Now...here we are.

Jon

I get the impression that up until very recently, most people would forever hold a gun responsible for early failings. Take the Beretta M-9 for instance. There was an imbalance in the slide and that caused a few to separate early on. Beretta fixed it right away but to this day, you still hear people going on about how weak their slides are and how easy they come apart.

With the boom of new science media and improved PR about product generations, people are starting to realize that manufacturers also notice these early problems and correct them.

The AR-15 by design doesn't leave allot of room for faulty machining and everyone is making them, which means we have a variety of quality levels. This of course means that we still have the old diversity in reliability, but for completely different reasons. My impression is that this is the chief problem with old vets.

The one thing old vets seam to be unexpectedly aware of, even over respectful of when it comes to the M-16 is the potency of the bullet.

I don't know if it's common but one odd thing I DID see was an uncle of mine (my grandmother's brother) get on his daughter's husband for taking an AR-10 bear hunting. His problem was that he though the gun wasn't powerful enough. Why, I don't know. He himself killed bears with a .30-06. The impression I get is that the gun it's self was so small that he didn't realize the ammunition was as large and powerful as it is.

[SPBCTS]

Not every hunter has a brain in his skull. Far from it. I've actually had one brag to me that he unloaded a 12 gauge riot shotgun on a squirrel that still got away. It's not hard to imagine someone like that supporting some parts of the anti-gun debate.

Ma I'd have a helluva time classifying that moron as a hunter. Sounds like another idiot that got a hold of a gun. He sure as heck ain't helping our cause.

On the subject of ground squirrels, I fought a problem with them for a number of years. The solution came in the form of an RWS Diana 460 sidecocker air rifle, scoped, launching .22 caliber pellets.

Freakin' think is fun, and deadly at 40 yards. ;D

[blue109]

I never really thought of the military aspect of it..but maybe theres something to the training(brainwashing) aspect. Lord knows I slept with that evil black rifle every night for about a year in the dessert. I handled one on a regular basis since basic training in 1995. I like other rifles..but nothing else feels "right" to me. I cant imagine having to give them up. Its a depressing thought.

[greenhornet-1]

I'm 57 and hunt with ar's. You should see the looks i get sometimes when i get out of my truck and get on a stand. Like, What the crap is that you have there??? It's my beowulf, you want to shoot it??  <laughs>