New to ARs, want to build not buy .338 federal.

[JakeLo1212]

Hey everyone, My name is Jacob and this is my first time owning/building an AR of any kind (not first time shooting) and had some questions.

I have wanted a .338 federal since I owned my first .308 and heard there was a necked up version, I have also always wanted to own an AR platform rifle so when I learned that a normal AR-10/AR-308 .308 bolt system would chamber a .338 I felt like it was a sign for me to bite the bullet (no pun intended). not to mention recent political shifts have me intimidated about my chances of making this happen in coming years. I have a few questions if anyone would be generous to answer them as I have no mentor through this process other than internet resources. 

1. besides the obvious different barrel, what else do I need to do different than a normal 7.62x51 AR-308/lr-308 setup to shoot .338 federal?

2. I am a college student on a budget so I was wondering where it was important to spend the extra cash, and where I can maybe look at cheaper options. for example, is a "high end" handguard necessary or is it just for looks and weight reduction? same thing with a stock and grip (not buffer system just stock)

3. where do I acquire my gas block, as barrel nut? does that come with my custom barrel I purchase? or do I need to look at purchasing some sort of separate piece? 

4. what's the best place to find parts for the best price? it seems to be difficult to compare prices as not many places online seem to carry the same products universally. 

5. any preferences for barrel length and twist rate for a .338 Federal? will be used primarily for deer hunting, maximum range 250 (never shot an animal over 170, I live in big woods) 

Thanks for any help or advice 

[Lonewolf McQuade]

Welcome @JakeLo1212! 

Jake? From State Farm? 

[edgecrusher]

@98Z5Vwill be by shortly, he has one of the few I know of. I would better be able to offer some suggestions if I knew your budget. I understand you want to save but you might be ok and not know it. First, the best inexpensive receivers I would suggest are the Aero M5 set. Handguard is more of a personal preference type thing and doesn’t affect performance in the least besides weight and possibly grip. Stock and grip are personal preference as well. Lots of good options out there. 

[Armed Eye Doc]

If you are not shooting any more than 250 yards, stick to a 16 inch barrel.  Anything longer will not gain you anything but weight.

[jtallen83]

2 hours ago, JakeLo1212 said:

besides the obvious different barrel, what else do I need to do different than a normal 7.62x51 AR-308/lr-308 setup to shoot .338 federal?

No

2 hours ago, JakeLo1212 said:

I am a college student on a budget

Take your time, get a list of what you need and watch the prices, I think there may be some good holiday deals this year. I got my 338 barrel on sale at Wilson Combat, under $200 and a great barrel. Keep your eyes peeled there;

https://shopwilsoncombat.com/338-Federal/products/740/

Some reading, @98Z5V has a build thread somewhere but I couldn't find it;

 

 

[Lane]

This appears to be the @98Z5V build so you can read up on it before he arrives. 

 

[Rsquared]

Welcome aboard from Maryland.

[unforgiven]

Welcome from Indiana brother

[Lane]

Welcome from New York state. I wanted to add:

10 hours ago, JakeLo1212 said:

not to mention recent political shifts have me intimidated about my chances of making this happen in coming years

This idea of build, not buy, is in fact a very important issue for me; and one that I fully support here. This is the ONLY reason I got excited about AR platform rifles... Once I realized I could build, and not buy; I was SOLD! The experience of building has been worthwhile to me in more ways than I could list off quickly here. A quality finished build is a significant point of pride no matter the cost of components (a budget build is still going to shoot). It's all about the struggles and learning that happen along the way. The process of building is just as much fun as getting everything running just right at the end.

The one thing I want to caution you on; is the college bit. I'm not sure where you live, but I read about a case of a college student living off campus who ended up with firearms charges because the university found out. Again; not sure even what state you are in even, but something to consider. My advice would be don't tell any of your friends.

[Steve crawford]

How the world has changed.  I went to college for a while.  My room mate turned 21 and wanted to buy a pistol.  He sold me his 22 cal. rifle so he could buy a 22 cal. pistol .   We would then each buy a brick of 22 ammo every month and after class two or three times a week, we would load up our guns from the dorm to his car and drive down to the creek where everybody else would go to shoot.  Then back to the dorm to clean guns.  That WAS the good old days.  😊😊😊

     Steve

[Lane]

12 minutes ago, Steve crawford said:

Then back to the dorm to clean guns.  That WAS the good old days.  😊😊😊

This makes me laugh too... Parents of a friend of mine met in college because of shooting. They both shot competitively. He was on the .22, and she was trap. They met because they were both the best shooters. And then my friend was born...

The only reason they met is because they were allowed to carry guns, and shoot competitively with the university's blessing.

[Armed Eye Doc]

8 hours ago, jtallen83 said:

Take your time, get a list of what you need and watch the prices, I think there may be some good holiday deals this year. I got my 338 barrel on sale at Wilson Combat, under $200 and a great barrel. Keep your eyes peeled there;

https://shopwilsoncombat.com/338-Federal/products/740/

I wouldn't say that Wilson will not make 338 Fed barrels.  But this is their current disclaimer on their barrel page.

Due to the unprecedented demand for our AR barrels line, we are having to make some hard choices on production to enable us to fill the most customer orders. In order to maximize our production and deliver the most barrels WITHOUT sacrificing any quality we must run higher quantities of fewer calibers and variations per production run. Until this massive panic buying subsides we will only be producing barrels in the following calibers and fewer variations within these calibers. We will fill backorders for other calibers / variations when we are able. Lead time is unknown at this time.

.223/5.56
6.5 Creedmoor
.300 Blackout
300 HAM'R
.308 Win
.458 SOCOM

[Armed Eye Doc]

The only place I have seen a 338 Fed that shows to be available is Shilen Rifles.  It is decidedly not a budget part.

[Armed Eye Doc]

Primary Arms has a Midwest Industries 12.625" 308AR handguard on sale for $139.99 right now.

https://www.primaryarms.com/midwest-industries-ar308-combat-rail-m-lok-handguard-dpms-low-12.625in

[98Z5V]

It's worth it to wait for the Wilson Combat barrel.  For 250 yards, hunting, you definitely don't need anything longer than the 16" barrel.   In the meantime, work on the rest of the parts for the build, and by the time you gather everything up - that barrel will probably be back.  You'll like the .338 Fed cartridge. 

I'm working on a 16" .358 Win right now.   The complete gun is done already - I just need to make ammo and run this thing. 

[JakeLo1212]

19 hours ago, edgecrusher said:

@98Z5Vwill be by shortly, he has one of the few I know of. I would better be able to offer some suggestions if I knew your budget. I understand you want to save but you might be ok and not know it. First, the best inexpensive receivers I would suggest are the Aero M5 set. Handguard is more of a personal preference type thing and doesn’t affect performance in the least besides weight and possibly grip. Stock and grip are personal preference as well. Lots of good options out there. 

Yeah I'm currently looking at an m5 UR, and I have a friend of a friend that works for TN arms co. that can maybe get me a small discount on a completed lower. still looking at handguard, grip, stock, optic and bcg

18 hours ago, jtallen83 said:

No

Take your time, get a list of what you need and watch the prices, I think there may be some good holiday deals this year. I got my 338 barrel on sale at Wilson Combat, under $200 and a great barrel. Keep your eyes peeled there;

https://shopwilsoncombat.com/338-Federal/products/740/

 

 

that what I am currently doing, I have everything listed that I have basically decided on, and looking for advice here to settle on the remaining parts (bcg and barrel basically) 

11 hours ago, Lane said:

The one thing I want to caution you on; is the college bit. I'm not sure where you live, but I read about a case of a college student living off campus who ended up with firearms charges because the university found out. Again; not sure even what state you are in even, but something to consider. My advice would be don't tell any of your friends.

 

10 hours ago, Steve crawford said:

How the world has changed.  I went to college for a while.  My room mate turned 21 and wanted to buy a pistol.  He sold me his 22 cal. rifle so he could buy a 22 cal. pistol .   We would then each buy a brick of 22 ammo every month and after class two or three times a week, we would load up our guns from the dorm to his car and drive down to the creek where everybody else would go to shoot.

     Steve

 

10 hours ago, Lane said:

This makes me laugh too...

There is a reason that I didn't add my location or university with my account or this post, I'm going to try and keep it under wraps until graduation. Although I am at a private, Christian university that lets their students conceal with a permit so I will likely be ok if they catch wind

8 hours ago, 98Z5V said:

It's worth it to wait for the Wilson Combat barrel.  For 250 yards, hunting, you definitely don't need anything longer than the 16" barrel.   In the meantime, work on the rest of the parts for the build, and by the time you gather everything up - that barrel will probably be back.  You'll like the .338 Fed cartridge. 

I'm working on a 16" .358 Win right now.   The complete gun is done already - I just need to make ammo and run this thing. 

That is currently what I am doing, don't want to purchase everything at one time, and I hope Wilson can restock by their holiday/black Friday sales occur. I shoot with buddies on occasion at longer ranges, if I were to acquire an 18 or 20 inch barrel,  how much would this help my velocity and accuracy? worth the extra weight and money? I am an accuracy junky and like to fiddle with my loads and setups until I'm way below MOA for bolt guns. I understand not to expect 3 bullets in the same hole with an AR but would longer/heavier barrel be worth my time at all? and .358 seems like a brute of a bullet, through an AR that would be a hell of a brush gun. 

Also thanks for all the welcome messages from everyone :)

[jtallen83]

37 minutes ago, JakeLo1212 said:

I shoot with buddies on occasion at longer ranges, if I were to acquire an 18 or 20 inch barrel,  how much would this help my velocity and accuracy? worth the extra weight and money?

What ranges? I have not stretched mine out past 100 yet but it I doubt I would see much difference in accuracy out to 300 yards, the barrel shoots better than me. I really like a balanced rifle so I went with the 14.7 inch to loose the weight up front, these things can get heavy.

[98Z5V]

13 hours ago, JakeLo1212 said:

I shoot with buddies on occasion at longer ranges, if I were to acquire an 18 or 20 inch barrel,  how much would this help my velocity and accuracy? worth the extra weight and money? I am an accuracy junky and like to fiddle with my loads and setups until I'm way below MOA for bolt guns. I understand not to expect 3 bullets in the same hole with an AR but would longer/heavier barrel be worth my time at all? and .358 seems like a brute of a bullet, through an AR that would be a hell of a brush gun.

For a .338 Fed AR, the longer 18" or 20" barrel isn't going to do anything for you that's beneficial.  Well, besides add swing weight to the gun.  For hunting, and 250 yards, the 16" is overkill, in a way.  Best scenario, even for another 100 yards on top of that, without building a shorter barrel and ending up going the SBR-route.  The 16" is the way to go. 

Here's my mantra on barrel length...   If you have an accurate gun, it's always going to be an accurate gun.  If it's an accurate 20" gun, and you want to cut the barrel down, it's still going to be accurate.  Barrel length only affects velocity, not accuracy.  And, a shiitty barrel is always gonna be a shiitty barrel, no way around that.  The WC barrel that you're looking at IS an accurate barrel, and it's one of their match barrels - it has all their tricks, including final hand-lapping.  That's why I think it's worth waiting for it. 

Post up your list of parts when you have time, and we'll look them over and see what's listed.  If something isn't going to work, or there's a better part out there, we'll see it in the list.   Short-cut the long-term diagnosis that way. 

[98Z5V]

Do you handload your own ammo?  That's gonna affect your accuracy, because off-the-shelf ammo is all hunting loads, and have "hunting accuracy."  Hits into a 7" or 9" vital zone is what the ammo manufacturers are going for with that stuff.  It's not bad - and it's good for breaking the gun in, when the time comes.  My best loads so far have been with Hornady 225gr SST projectiles.  They definitely don't suck. 

[JakeLo1212]

15 hours ago, 98Z5V said:

Do you handload your own ammo?  That's gonna affect your accuracy, because off-the-shelf ammo is all hunting loads, and have "hunting accuracy."  Hits into a 7" or 9" vital zone is what the ammo manufacturers are going for with that stuff.  It's not bad - and it's good for breaking the gun in, when the time comes.  My best loads so far have been with Hornady 225gr SST projectiles.  They definitely don't suck. 

Ok, ill probably stick with 18" and under pick up whatever becomes available first. And I do handload, but I've never loaded .338 federal only .204 ruger, .308, and 7mm mag.(obviously its my first .338). Id love to put together a solid load with the 230 ELD-X I have a lot of experience and confidence with that line. plan on experimenting with it for sure. My current list (subject to change) :

Completed Lower: TN arms Co AR-308 https://tnarmsco.com/complete-ar-308-lower-receiver/

M5 Aero precision upper reciever  - https://www.aeroprecisionusa.com/m5-assembled-upper-receiver-fde-cerakote

Yall's suggested Wilson Combat .338 barrel 

Handguard - https://alexprofab.com/product/ar10-15-fde-cerakote/

undecided on BCG grip and stock, open to suggestions 

Not sure what my plans are for muzzle device, cant suppress in my state without permit, so will look for some brakes and flash hiders along the way, also opwn to suggestions. 

 

 

[JakeLo1212]

On 9/16/2021 at 9:35 AM, jtallen83 said:

What ranges? I have not stretched mine out past 100 yet but it I doubt I would see much difference in accuracy out to 300 yards, the barrel shoots better than me. I really like a balanced rifle so I went with the 14.7 inch to loose the weight up front, these things can get heavy.

we have a range that goes to 700, obviously im not looking for that kind of shooting but we do push our bolt guns out there pretty often and I would mind trying some 300-400 groups for $h!ts and gigs

[dpete]

Do you know for sure that the TN arms lower will mate with the Aero upper? Unless you know FOR SURE do some checking before spending money. No milspec in the 308 AR world and manufacturers do whatever they please with specs.

[JakeLo1212]

1 hour ago, dpete said:

Do you know for sure that the TN arms lower will mate with the Aero upper? Unless you know FOR SURE do some checking before spending money. No milspec in the 308 AR world and manufacturers do whatever they please with specs.

Both say that they fit gen-1 dpms 308 style, but I will contact them directly to make sure, I feel like its probably not the first time they've been asked 😂

[jtallen83]

2 hours ago, JakeLo1212 said:

Both say that they fit gen-1 dpms 308 style,

The best advice at this stage is to get upper and lower from the same maker so there is no question or finger pointing when they don't fit, grab an Aero set, they are as close to problem free as anything out there and reasonable money.

[dpete]

I just looked at the TN arms listing for that lower and the 2nd picture they have there is with it mated to an Aero upper.  With that said, the TN lower is "Receiver Constructed of High-Strength Nylon 6-6 and Marine-Grade Brass inserts". 

If it was me I'de pony up the extra cash and get this:   https://www.aeroprecisionusa.com/m5-complete-lower-receiver-fde-225

Its on sale this weekend, its all metal, its Aero, and it has way less chance of self destructing in your hand if something goes wrong.