I give up

[jon308]

OK so nobody makes a decent AR Type rifle except Colt, Larue, LMT, Scar, Bravo etc. And you cant get your hands on them and when you do its around the 3000. dollar mark when your talkin 30cal.  So what is the guy who cant spend 3000 supposed to do to get a 1/2 way decent rifle to bet his life on

[Matt.Cross]

He buys a reliable build from someone who is tired of buying shelf rifles and loves building! Seriously brother, their are some good "already customized" rifles out there that were shelf bought and then modified before the purchaser got the itch to build. Seek those out in the "For sale" sections of some of the larger gun forums on the 'Net. You can find a great rifle at awesome prices if you don't get stuck on the "used" label.

Heck, you can buy my Mk12 build off of me if you're really desperate!

[planeflyer21]

I bought a RRA Operator LAR-8 for about $1400 shipped.  Liked it so much, sold some stuff and got the LAR-8 Elite Operator for about the same price.

Maybe not "decent" like Colt, LaRue, LMT, etc., but it shoots, shoots accurately and well, and I've not had an issue with them.

Others will tell you about ordering RRA and having long wait times.  Just get it if it is in stock, like me.

You can also get an A3 or A4 style from RRA or Armalite for a street price of $1300 or less, with DPMS or Bushmaster coming in lower than that with some models.

You may have to tinker some with the "indecent" models but lots of folks here swear by them.

Jon

[jon308]

I have a DPMS 308T, There are some things I would like to get done to it, but when I go to lgs instead they want me to upgrade to a more trustworthy rifle as mine isnt worth trusting your life with and if Im serious I need to go another route, so what else is there without spending 3000.00 Ive looked at RRA cant see any difference for the money

[Matt.Cross]

I have a DPMS 308T, There are some things I would like to get done to it, but when I go to lgs instead they want me to upgrade to a more trustworthy rifle as mine isnt worth trusting your life with and if Im serious I need to go another route, so what else is there without spending 3000.00 Ive looked at RRA cant see any difference for the money

What has your own experience with the rifle been? What's the rate of failure? I'd like to know more about your situation, but it sounds to me like someone has a vested interest in your need for a better rifle. Trust me, you can make a dead ringer out of that DPMS for a heck of a lot less than $3k. I'm leery when a gun shop owner tries to tell me that my rifle that has hundreds of rounds of flawless operation through it, isn't worth staking my life on, especially when he's got a "replacement" on the rack.

Trust me, there's plenty of members on here who can tell you how little it takes to get even a slightly flawed DPMS running like a sewing machine. I can think of about 5 major upgrades you can do to your hardware to improve accuracy and reliability before you surpass the $1k mark.

1. High Quality Trigger

2. High Quality Barrel

3. Heavy Buffer/Recoil Spring

4. Stock Mods/Replacements

5. Free float options

In any one of these five options, you have lots of leeway to pick good options and displace money to put on another item, and still come out better than you were with an off the shelf rifle. That's what this forum is all about brother, talk to some people about their mods before you decide you don't like the rifle you have.

[98Z5V]

I have a DPMS 308T, There are some things I would like to get done to it, but when I go to lgs instead they want me to upgrade to a more trustworthy rifle as mine isnt worth trusting your life with and if Im serious I need to go another route, so what else is there without spending 3000.00 Ive looked at RRA cant see any difference for the money

That's a LGS that's filling your head with bullpoopy, right there.  I'd find another LGS. 

Have them sign up for an account, and log in here, and I'd be glad to discuss it with them.  <thumbsup>

[dagamore]

my dmps lr-308 run like a top.

I have put about 200 rounds of milsurplus through it and never a hickup.

i have put ~500 rounds of winchester 150 hunting ammo through it and still not a hickup.

I dont like it when any LGS talks crap about an owners gun, unless its a llama, then its ok to talk trash about them.

[tackleberry2000]

I got an AP4, scope, mount, trigger, new free float rail and magpul furnature for under 2k (had the trigger for another build). Accurate and reliable so far. If your happy with your gun thats all that matters.

[jon308]

I have no issues with my rifle it shoots what ever I put through it good stuff cheap stuff hand loads I guess what started this is I asked what I should have on hand in a shtf situation and need replacement parts or what I could have a smith do now to prevent future problems. I was then told how cheap and unreliable DPMS was and not being a battle proven weapon not somthing you would want to bet your life on. Anywhere from triggers or springs breaking to gas blocks coming loose, gas tubes getting pluged, bolts breaking etc, This scares the crap out of me if Im depending on it. Actually its quite accurate and does not jam but I havent put 3000 rnds through it in a weekend either.

[98Z5V]

I was then told how cheap and unreliable DPMS was and not being a battle proven weapon not somthing you would want to bet your life on. Anywhere from triggers or springs breaking to gas blocks coming loose, gas tubes getting pluged, bolts breaking etc, This scares the crap out of me...

Like I said.  You have a POS LGS.  "POS" stands for "Piece Of poop."  THey're preying on you, and it worked.  As evidenced by what I stopped my quote at, "This scares the crap out of me..."

Get a new LGS.

Ask your LGS this question:  "When was the last time one of YOU employess put a .308 AR into a combat zone (only four current ones in the last 10 years, publicly, and they're Iraq, Afghanistan, Horn of Africa, and the Philippines).

Ask them WHO among their employess has been deployed tho those locations, in support of, or involved in, combat operations, WITH a .308 AR...

You'll get a deer-in-the headlights look.

Your LGS already won - they beat you.  You believe their bullpoopy... 

If you think your gun sucks, I'll buy it off you for 35% less than what you paid for it.  You can "get out from under it" that way, and move onto something that you don't need, but makes them money.

PM me your purchase receipt, and I'll start working on it.  <thumbsup>

[Robocop1051]

The DPMS Recon and the Armalite AR10-A A4 Carbine are both $1,500... And they are both very nice starts.

[tolbndfishin]

The assurance that this gentleman's gun is going to fail him by his lgs is very disturbing to me.

If they had your best interest in mind, they would not try to sell you something new to replace what many here (none of whom I have ever met but have proven through their experiences, and in reference to other experiences from reputable professional individuals/companies that they're worth listening to) consider to be a completely functional and reliable brand.  There are many small changes you can make to improve your faith in your rifle (and that goes for any brand), but the most important is going to be find someone that isn't going to shake your belief in your rifle with what is more than likely an unfounded belief that a couple stories they heard from a friend of a friend of an acquaintance told them (or even more likely an inexperienced customer that didn't know what he was talking about had a bad experience).  "My buddy had a 'insert brand here' and it wouldn't cycle, but his son's friend's dad's brother had 'insert different brand here' and it was immensely better"  See my point? Just disturbing........ >:( 

Russ

[unforgiven]

Brother the guys here can help you bring what you have up to snuff.As long as the barrel isn't bent like a horseshoe you should be ok.After you change what needs changeing shoot the hell out of it and that will restore your confidence in you'r rifle.You'r expense should be less than the cost of a new rifle IMO.Just my 2 mags.

[98Z5V]

I read this thread title, originally, and heard in my head "I give up..."

My first reaction, that I fought against replying to, but can't give in NOW to, is:

Nobody likes a quitter...

I dunno - maybe it's just me.  I'ma dickhead.  <dontknow>

Lay down a quit, dude, because your LGS has brainwashed you.  You're already beaten, just by them, and their will to talk poop to you and try to get you to spend money.  They've already beaten you, by what you say.

You can fight back, too, and realize that they're full of poop.  And you can fight back another way, and get them to make their comments public - again, bring them right here.  Point them right to me.  I'd welcome it.  <thumbsup>

[98Z5V]

<lmao>  I'm gonna poop my fuckin' pants if I find out his local dealer is the Gun Gallery, in Jax, and he's been talking to Neil for all his info...  :o

I'll be such the ass for that...  <laughs>

[jon308]

I guess after thinking about it and hearing what all of you say, Youre right their just trying to sell me on the fact I need to purchase another weapon.  What is it I can do to make sure this rifle is in the best shape it can be. What should I look for or change. Ive done a trigger job on it other than that it works good out to 200yds which is all the range has. Things I would like to change the bigest complaint I have is the carbine length forearm its to short with bipod installed, maybe quad rail upfront the same height as flat top and adjustable mag pul stock and thats it. Other than the mechanic's issue if there really is any

[planeflyer21]

Back when I had my FFL selling guns was cool but fixing them was WAY cooler.

These days though, most LGS staff/owners have no clue about making firearms work.

Tom has it right with employees having "that deer in the headlight look".  Call them on anything, ANYTHING, you know to be a fact when they are spewing sales bullpoopy and you will see them freeze.  From the stupid almighty "Pump-shotguns/revolvers never jam," to the dunce-oid sexist "Snub-nose revolvers are good, simple guns for women."  I'd bet the lunch Tom owes me at La Casita 93 out of 101 gun sales people can't shoot a snub-nose revolver for poop.

Talk to most people ready to fill out paperwork for SS and many will tell you "The only really reliable rifle is a bolt-action," or if they had wood-and-steel semi-auto military experience "ARs aren't reliable because they crap where they eat!"

Find someone that, when you ask them a question, replies with either "I don't know but I can find out," or "Do you really want to know?"  If any of their answers to your questions start with "Everybody knows..." or sounds like "My brother's friend's room mate's uncle's janitor, who is a veteran, says..."

Don't let Tom's beratement get you down.  Meet his challenge!

Jon

[shepp]

I gotta agree with the guys, been here less then a year, I've gotten great info from here and other places. As I also found out gun shop owners are just another form of sales man. The shop I was going to buy from turned out to be a bunch of lieing crooks so I took my business else's where. Sounds like thier trying to get you to spend your money with the fords better then Chevy cheap talk.

Btw I love my dpms mk12

[edgecrusher]

@jon308, keep the rifle.

get a new free float hand guard, it's the forearm replacement you're talking about. pick out a magpul stock you like, on carbines i like the acs, on my Larue i have the prs. we can help you get the parts on, help you order them, what ever you need. we won't steer you wrong, your choices, we will help.

the only thing i would suggest other than what you've listed is a heavy buffer and spring, it'll help with recoil.

[Robocop1051]

1. Troy Ind free float tube

2. PWS FSC30 muzzle device

3. Slash's heavy buffer and spring

4. BAD Inc ambidextrous safety (because they are AWESOME)

5. Magpul makes great/affordable stocks and pistol grips. Also check out Mission First Tactical.

6. I would bother with an expensive trigger till you've mastered the rifle you have.

You bought a 308AR... You just entered the world of Monster Trucks and race cars. There is no more complaining about price. If you can't afford Mario Andretti's car, then you buy one piece at a time and build it over several months.

There are rifles that are considered "better" than others, but that doesn't mean that that you can't build one up to be as good. Personally I think the LaRue OBR is likely the best off the shelf rifle out there... Yet I don't own it. Instead I built a rifle (over time) that is to my exact design. I would compare it to any off the shelf battle rifle. When I get my scope and off-set red dot installed, I will compete this rifle against all those off the shelf Ferraris and Corvettes.

[Magwa]

OK so nobody makes a decent AR Type rifle except Colt, Larue, LMT, Scar, Bravo etc. And you cant get your hands on them and when you do its around the 3000. dollar mark when your talkin 30cal.  So what is the guy who cant spend 3000 supposed to do to get a 1/2 way decent rifle to bet his life on

  I am late to this party  but sorry your information is wrong in all areas the high end guns are not the only good guns out there  this is one area that really makes me mad and that is Bull $hit info on guns there are many good reliable guns for alot less than 3000. buck I shoot a DPMS bought it new got a good deal 900.00 and it has never failed in any way it is accurate,never jams no FTE or FTF and will do anything i need to do with it including beting my life on it and for 5.56 build your own for less, I built 2 rifles a M4 and a A2 for less than 1000.00 bucks from Palmentto state armory and they sell nothing but good parts and they have awesome prices.... I do not buy into the high end guns are the only ones out there if they were I would not have one.

[unforgiven]

Glad you'r gonna hang with the rifle you got,I'm thinkin with a few mods you are going to be very happy with the rifle you have.Plus the satisfaction of troubleshooting and correcting the problems yourself. <thumbsup> That S&W I have with the 2" barrel is turning out to be a PITA to shoot at any distance compared to the 4.5" pistols I have.But I'll get it just need more practice ;).And I won't go to rehab cause nobody likes a quitter <lmao> <laughs>.

[Magwa]

Jon go to this thread there is a great discussion i started on changing things on my DPMS rifle and the biggest one is the carbine forarm  and the folks here have been simply awesome with their their knowledge and help

http://308ar.com/forum/hunting/thoughts-on-carrying-lr308/

[jon308]

Thank's  I feel alot better about my rifle like I said it has never failed, well when I first bought it I wasnt giving it enough lube, but after that issue its been great, I will go ahead and do to it what I want and quit asking shops to do it. And its true nobody seem's to work on them, they would rather sell you another one. I haven't quit look's like I just started. THANK'S

[Tripledeuce]

  I have a DPMS bbl on a RR rifle.

  Both companys said it would'nt work.

    Not being one to simply accept things, I miked and measured,scratched my head, and went ahead and did it.

    Ran it dry at first, untill I found this site, and have @500 rounds through it now with NO failures of any kind.

    To many people today who call themselvs  gunsmiths  who are nothing more than glorified parts changers.

    Make the changes you want, and find your confidence in the gun.

    Have fun

    respectfully

    Terry