New guy, For small frame interchangable 308

[Fat Dan Aykroyd]

On 1/19/2020 at 11:16 PM, 98Z5V said:

You're gonna be fun.

I only quote you to tell you that you're a complete ass and don't know what you're talking about. DPMS basically made the GII an open source platform. They were instrumental in "normalizing" the AR10 (think SR25 pattern). They bet big on the GII and won. I will not only tell you what I know but I will tell you why I know it.

Walked in to LGS and I see a Diamondback Firearms AR10 sitting on the shelf, 16" barrel. I have been shopping for an AR10 and had no idea what a "small frame" gun was at the time. I look at the gun and the owner brings out a Diamonback AR10 (SR25 pattern) pistol with a brace on it, readily available on Diamondback's website. We start chatting and he lets me take it out back to the range and shoot a couple of rounds. Gun is very smooth for what it is (a 13" AR10 SR25 pattern with a blade brace) so I jump at the one on the shelf and drop a K. Start ordering parts for it (phase 5 bolt release, trigger, muzzle device, etc). Bolt release comes in and it wont work, bolt carrier wont even travel more than a half inch. Multiple conversations with Diamondback, Phase 5, 2 DPMS dealers, and a couple of gunsmiths and heres what I found out...

I had purchased part number DB308G2B, which was a PART FOR PART copy of the DPMS GII... yes, you read that right, PART FOR PART. DPMS made the GII platform open source, so any one could make it. It was like pulling teeth getting info from these people. Adams Arms manufactures under license because they used part of the design and added a piston upper to the GII lower. Also found out that POF's stuff is mostly proprietary, especially the BCG. Look at their website for more info. Not only did Diamondback make a PART FOR PART copy, Remington got involved with the platform and the R10 will have more than 90% compatibility. They changed the barrel nut a bit to improve accuracy. The different parts have not been cross installed and tested as far as I know. Diamondback made a good run of a few hundred guns, but has since stopped production AND support for the gun. Im guessing the recent shake up with the Remington and DPMS family of companies has something to do with it. Same reason for the web pages being down.

Now, if you would stop being an ass long enough to do a little interwebs looking you would know that Sig had a pre production gun at Shot Show range day. Springfield already has one going, and is shipping new models of it Q2. Remington makes one and I hear its damn nice. Adams Arms is churning them out as fast as possible. Diamondback, ZEV, and F4 defense made probably more than 6000 copies between them from what I can tell, but all dropped out due to lack of marketing, and thats exactly what caused the OEM's that made them go under. Diamondback presented ZERO info on the platform in ANY of their online presence... just kind of expected people to know what it was somehow. ZEV and F4 produced over the top expensive stuff, and nobody knew what it was. Aero Precision and PSA are rumored to be getting into the game. The only reason DPMS isn't making them right now is because of corporate restructuring, but there are still plenty for sale.

The new players at the table are the big ones, and they are sticking around for a reason. The platform kicks a whole bunch of ass. My Diamondback DB308G2B punched 1.2 MOA out of the box with match ammo. Now add a trigger and a muzzle device (currently shopping for a barrel) and I have printed targets as small as .8 MOA. This was all done in an indoor range at 100 yards. It kicked out of the box like a pissed off mule, but some goodies tamed that a bit. Still stronger than an AR15 but not as bad. Lower weight, better accuracy, better ballistics, smaller package, more modular, and easier to handle 308... that's why it was a big deal.

The whole idea was taking the FCU and buffer system from and AR15 and making most everything else .308. Doing that actually presented some form of a rough standard, because the FCU was already standardized in the AR15. The open sourcing allowed different OEMS to buy castings/forgings from the same peeps making them for DPMS.

Now that I have educated you on the subject matter, go verify it for yourself if its that important to you. I spent so much time here typing to help a fellow enthusiast that asked the original question, not to scold you (that was just a bonus). That is what you're supposed to do in a community such as this. I will never understand why people feel the need to be whiny little bitches and poke a hole in something instead of helping. I think you belong on Reddit or 4chan.

[98Z5V]

I knew you'd be fun. Congrats - you exceeded even any expectation that I had for you.  Very well done, my man, very well done. You're a fucking hero. 

[98Z5V]

6 minutes ago, Fat Dan Aykroyd said:

Now, if you would stop being an ass long enough to do a little interwebs looking you would know that Sig had a pre production gun at Shot Show range day. Springfield already has one going, and is shipping new models of it Q2. Remington makes one and I hear its damn nice. Adams Arms is churning them out as fast as possible.

I was at the last SHOT Show Range Day.  This year. Didn't even see SIG out there.  Remington just dropped all MSRs, no longer producing them, so I don't know what planet you're talking about - but it's not the big rock that we live on.  Right here. 

Please quote your sources for your magical information.  Direct links will do.

[98Z5V]

21 minutes ago, Fat Dan Aykroyd said:

 Aero Precision and PSA are rumored to be getting into the game. The only reason DPMS isn't making them right now is because of corporate restructuring, but there are still plenty for sale.
 

Aero Precision isn't "getting into that game" at all.  You don't have any idea how hard I hung out with the Aero guys and Ballistic Advantage guys at SHOT this year.  You're fucking clueless.  DPMS is now out of business - if you've been "keeping up with the games" -  you don't know WTF you're talking about... 

Good luck, though...  

 

Edited February 14, 2020 by 98Z5V

[98Z5V]

Drive on, Fat Dan.  Get back with your info when you can find it - with sources. I'm really looking forward to it... 

[shooterrex]

This is some of the funniest$hit I've seen here in a while.

[RedRiverII]

Talk is cheap.  Be careful who you listen to,  they may just be regurgitating some other folks words.  Most manufacturers won't give the proper info on the phone for a couple of reasons.  They don't want you to be able to build their model,  think Sig at this point,  and they want you to buy their goods,  i.e.the whole rifle.  Most of my friends,  my life long friends anyhow became friends after having fights,  mostly with fists and later with words.  This could become a terrific learning thread or some bs thread,  I'm hoping for the former.  

[Ravenworks]

5 hours ago, shooterrex said:

This is some of the funniest$hit I've seen here in a while.

Yes it is,all he got from shot was a 3K bar tab.

I had to laugh when I seen his name tag it said "Probie", dude get back on your bi-polar meds.

You really are starting to look like a gut with arms from all the drinking.

[Ravenworks]

5 hours ago, 98Z5V said:

You don't have any idea how hard I hung out with the Aero guys and Ballistic Advantage guys at SHOT this year.

 

You sound like a groupie, did you tell them your lumberjack stories?

[unforgiven]

9 hours ago, shooterrex said:

This is some of the funniest$hit I've seen here in a while.

Brother you've missed a few of the hall of famers that have passed through.

Best was the bedwetter that insisted on glueing a buttpad on his rifle. 

[98Z5V]

15 hours ago, Ravenworks said:

You sound like a groupie, did you tell them your lumberjack stories?

You worried about me for some reason?  I lived in WA for 12 years, WAY back when Aero didn't even brand their own lowers - but made them for 80% of the industry. That's way back when they were located right outside the back gate of McChord AFB.    For me to connect with these guys, talk shiit, tell stories - EPIC.  They knew. Oh, and Ballistic Advantage was in the booth with them?  Bonus.  Met Clint, owner of BA, told him my BA Mk12-barrel success, multiple barrels lengths and calibers - drank beers with him once they broke the kegs out.  

You jealous,or something?  Worried that people here are making connections in the firearms industry?  If that's the case, you'd be jealous as hell that I talk to the CEO of Alexander Arms routinely, talking about Grendel info.  It is what it is.  Don't hate. 

I might get him out to the Fall Shoot this year...  

[Ravenworks]

Dude,I'm not worried about you, and I sure as hell don't hate you.

You do have a big line of BS and little man syndrome.

I sit back and watch you talk down to just about every new person that comes along. You drive away a lot of people.

I stick around for the entertainment value

Don't inflate your worth because in reality you have only accomplished a small percentage of your grandious BS.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[unforgiven]

^^^ You are the entertainment.

 

[jtallen83]

[Matt.Cross]

3 hours ago, Ravenworks said:

Don't inflate your worth because in reality you have only accomplished a small percentage of your grandious BS.

Not trying to be rude, but you really don't have a clue. It's nothing personal, don't take it the wrong way. Many of us here know him and his history personally, and have spent many hours in his company.

Love him, hate him, or indifferent, you're just wrong about this. A Walmart greeter he ain't, but he's smarter than the devil himself and tougher than woodpecker lips.

[Armed Eye Doc]

Armed eye docs wife here, lolololololol. That is all, please continue, Ron is reading this to me at the bar.  Love you Tom.  Hugs

[Vegan]

Drunken I am !!!  I don't think any of us have much room to argue with todays political climate.  We are all under fire from the Democatic party !  Gather your thoughts and take a minute. 

Non of us are born all-knowing.  Some of us believe in extraterrestrials (such as me) and some don't (such as my brother).    Damn, its approximately 100 years later and people are just waking up to Tesla.

If you don't keep an open mind, you're surely never to succeed !  

Joe Rogan with Garrett Reisman: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3RG5pXTpLBI

Jimmy Church Radio: https://jimmychurchradio.com/

Ha, some good $#!T I'm drinkin !

Edited February 16, 2020 by Vegan

[98Z5V]

You go boy.  Rip it up. 

You know that Remington just shut down DPMS, right?  All those GII dreams are swirling right now, at the bottom of the toilet, about to go down.  Maybe PSA can keep you alive, with the brief run that they tried with this platform.  Lifetime Guarantee from them - but it won't work, out of the box. 

Time for you to look for something else, that's reliable. 

[Vegan]

Turns out that Smith & Wessons M&P 10 allows  DPMS G2  critical parts, such as BGC and Barrel... Yeah, its true  !!   What this means to me... I can swap a Adams Arms BCG and Gas Block  (Big Fan!). 

http://smith-wessonforum.com/smith-wesson-m-p10-rifles/460403-replacement-barrels-m-p-10-a.html

Edited February 16, 2020 by Vegan

[98Z5V]

10 hours ago, Ravenworks said:

Dude,I'm not worried about you, and I sure as hell don't hate you.

You do have a big line of BS and little man syndrome.

I sit back and watch you talk down to just about every new person that comes along. You drive away a lot of people.

I stick around for the entertainment value

Don't inflate your worth because in reality you have only accomplished a small percentage of your grandious BS.

  I certainly don't have any Little Man Syndrome...    You might possibly be a dumbass.  As my Grandpa always told me - Don't let your Bulldog Mouth outrun your Canary Ass. 

You've obviously never had that advice given to you by a father or grandfather.  I'm grateful for mine, though. 

You have no idea, @Ravenworks - zero clue - as to who I am, what I've done, and what I do.  You're an idiot, in respect to that.  But you continue, drive on, do what you do, think what you think, and apply your bullshiit to me in any manner or fashion that you see fit.  The bottom line in it all is simple -it just makes you look stupid. 

Good job, by the way - whether or not you were trying to achieve that - you definitely did it, with flying fucking colors.  You rock. 

Edited February 16, 2020 by 98Z5V

[98Z5V]

11 hours ago, Ravenworks said:

I sit back and watch you talk down to just about every new person that comes along.

In specific reference to this, right here, I will tell you this, right now - I only do that to assholes.  When someone comes on here and decides that they're gonna be a total dickhead - I will definitely take that fight, ever single time. 

You keep your game-talk, though, and pimp that as a narrative - just like Dems do - if you say it enough, maybe people (sheeple) will believe the bullshiit that you're spreading.  So, talk down about me all you want - spread the horseshiit that I attack new people.  You say anything you want.  I can take it.  Bottom line is pretty simple, though - I'd rather help new people solve whatever issue their gun is having, and I do that routinely - very regularly here.  I'll never help out an As$hole or a dickhead, though - I'll treat them exactly as they've treated the rest of the members of this board. They get to eat their own Shiit-Sandwich, and I'll feed it to them.

You fall into that Dickhead category, too - in case you never knew that about yourself.  Well done.  You "Exceeded Course Standards" in that regard. 

Edited February 16, 2020 by 98Z5V

[98Z5V]

6 hours ago, Armed Eye Doc said:

Armed eye docs wife here, lolololololol. That is all, please continue, Ron is reading this to me at the bar.  Love you Tom.  Hugs

Susan, you rock, and I love ya too...  Bring Doc out there soon!!!  

[jtallen83]

54 minutes ago, 98Z5V said:

In specific reference to this, right here, I will tell you this, right now - I only do that to assholes.  When someone comes on here and decides that they're gonna be a total dickhead - I will definitely take that fight, ever single time. 

You know I had to add to this, it might be your perception, and many times you end up right but honestly you come off as a dick for no reason many times. Whatever you do don’t start trying to understand where someone else is coming from, don’t even think about giving a new guy a little slack. (Sarcastic)
I see you prematurely chase off new people, but that’s just how I see it, I have never been in your presence and frankly your in person reputation doesn’t mean a thing when all a person is seeing is  your words on a screen. But you do you, whether it drives away members or not.

[98Z5V]

8 minutes ago, jtallen83 said:

You know I had to add to this, it might be your perception, and many times you end up right but honestly you come off as a dick for no reason many times. Whatever you do don’t start trying to understand where someone else is coming from, don’t even think about giving a new guy a little slack. (Sarcastic)
I see you prematurely chase off new people, but that’s just how I see it, I have never been in your presence and frankly your in person reputation doesn’t mean a thing when all a person is seeing is  your words on a screen. But you do you, whether it drives away members or not.

The only people that think I come off as a dick - are dickheads.  I'm far from that, and if you knew me, Jim - and you should by now, how many years?  How many PMs? - if you knew me Jim, you'd know that already. 

I have zero patience for complete assholes.  Won't give then the time of day.  You shouldn't be shocked or surprised by that statement.

[Vegan]

3 hours ago, jtallen83 said:

You know I had to add to this, it might be your perception, and many times you end up right but honestly you come off as a dick for no reason many times. Whatever you do don’t start trying to understand where someone else is coming from, don’t even think about giving a new guy a little slack. (Sarcastic)
I see you prematurely chase off new people, but that’s just how I see it, I have never been in your presence and frankly your in person reputation doesn’t mean a thing when all a person is seeing is  your words on a screen. But you do you, whether it drives away members or not.

I agree !  

Plus, we can't afford to be such assholes in this political evironment ...Join, or die !    If we die, who do we blame ?????????????