Matt.Cross Posted January 31, 2022 Report Share Posted January 31, 2022 On 1/30/2022 at 11:06 AM, dpete said: Sincere question to those that own full auto, or NFA items in general. Do local, or state police, even game wardens have any juristiction or right to ask to see paperwork for that NFA item? Isn't it above their level being ATF controlled? Granted you might be facing an individual who thinks he has the right to enforce anything and would arrest first and check the law later, and just whipping out the paperwork keeps things friendly, but does anyone but an ATF enforcement agent have the right to check you? There are two domains of authority concerning NFA items: the IRS, who is responsible for determining the lawfulness of ownership, and the issuance of tax stamps, and the BATFE who is responsible for the enforcement of the relevant NFA laws on behalf of the Federal Government and the IRS. The direct answer to your question, is no they do not. However, that will not stop them from detaining you on the grounds of probable cause and holding you until you can clear yourself with the relevant authorities. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted March 25, 2022 Author Report Share Posted March 25, 2022 (edited) Breaking News: ATF Announces Action on Forced Reset Triggers Recoil Staff March 24, 2022 ATF Announces Action on Forced Reset Triggers | RECOIL (recoilweb.com) In an open letter emailed to FFL holders across the United States on March 24, 2022, the BATFE addresses Forced Reset Triggers (FRTs). < 1/2 The text follows (emphasis added by the BATFE): The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF) recently examined devices commonly known as “forced reset triggers” (FRTs) and has determined that some of them are “firearms” and “machineguns” as defined in the National Firearms Act (NFA), and “machineguns” as defined in the Gun Control Act (GCA). These particular FRTs are being marketed as replacement triggers for AR-type firearms. Unlike traditional triggers and binary triggers (sometimes referred to generally as “FRTs”), the subject FRTs do not require shooters to pull and then subsequently release the trigger to fire a second shot. Instead, these FRTs utilize the firing cycle to eliminate the need for the shooter to release the trigger before a second shot is fired. By contrast, some after-market triggers have similar components but also incorporate a disconnector or similar feature to ensure that the trigger must be released before a second shot may be fired and may not be machineguns. Both the NFA and GCA regulate machineguns. “Machinegun” is defined under 26 U.S.C. § 5845(b) and 18 U.S.C. § 921(a)(23) as— Any weapon which shoots, is designed to shoot, or can be readily restored to shoot, automatically more than one shot, without manual reloading, by a single function of the trigger. The term shall also include the frame or receiver of any such weapon, any part designed and intended solely and exclusively, or combination of parts designed and intended, for use in converting a weapon into a machinegun, and any combination of parts from which a machinegun can be assembled if such parts are in the possession or under the control of a person. (Emphasis added.) ATF’s examination found that some FRT devices allow a firearm to automatically expel more than one shot with a single, continuous pull of the trigger. For this reason, ATF has concluded that FRTs that function in this way are a combination of parts designed and intended for use in converting a weapon into a machinegun, and hence, ATF has classified these devices as a “machinegun” as defined by the NFA and GCA. Accordingly, ATF’s position is that any FRT that allows a firearm to automatically expel more than one shot with a single, continuous pull of the trigger is a “machinegun”, and is accordingly subject to the GCA prohibitions regarding the possession, transfer, and transport of machineguns under 18 U.S.C. §§ 922(o) and 922(a)(4). They are also subject to registration, transfer, taxation, and possession restrictions under the NFA. See 26 U.S.C. §§ 5841, 5861; 27 CFR 479.101. Under 26 U.S.C. § 5871, any person who violates or fails to comply with the provisions of the NFA may be fined up to $10,000 per violation and is subject to imprisonment for a term of up to ten years. Further, pursuant to 26 U.S.C. § 5872, any machinegun possessed or transferred in violation of the NFA is subject to seizure and forfeiture. Under 18 U.S.C. § 924(a)(2), any person who violates § 922(o) may be sent to prison for up to 10 years and fined up to $250,000 per person or $500,000 per organization. Based on ATF’s determination that the FRTs that function as described above are “machineguns” under the NFA and GCA, ATF intends to take appropriate remedial action with respect to sellers and possessors of these devices. Current possessors of these devices are encouraged to contact ATF for further guidance on how they may divest possession. If you are uncertain whether the device you possess is a machinegun as defined by the GCA and NFA, please contact your local ATF Field Office. You may consult the local ATF Office’s webpage for office contact information. Edited March 25, 2022 by 98Z5V Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blue109 Posted March 25, 2022 Report Share Posted March 25, 2022 Let me go ahead and give those boys a call. Wouldn't want to be in violation! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lane Posted March 28, 2022 Report Share Posted March 28, 2022 A bit long winded; and the video is out of sync with the audio. But good information about the legal fight that has been going on. It is not over yet... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted April 1, 2022 Author Report Share Posted April 1, 2022 Rare Breed sent out an email tonight: As most of you are already well aware, the ATF has gone rogue and is operating outside the rule of law by bypassing Congress to unilaterally expand the definition of “machinegun” in their attempt to outlaw FRTs. The National Association for Gun Rights (NAGR) has recently stepped to offer support by providing our supporters with a very easy way to have their voices heard. I couldn't be anymore sincere when I say this. We need your help and I am asking you to do two things. 1. Click this link, fill out the form, and allow the NAGR to send a letter on your behalf to your representatives along with another copy directly to the ATF. https://oneclickpolitics.global.ssl.fastly.net/messages/edit?_kx=fZn-PyCnNEUH-3y6fhBxzbYNT_fvWqGyc17Prp3s310%3D.ThLeNS&promo_id=15300&utm_campaign=NAGR+-+NoTriggerBan.org+-+1+(VQ49RJ)&utm_medium=email&utm_source=Dealer+List 2. Forward this email to your family, friends, and loved ones and encourage them to do the same. We cannot do this without your support so please, take 2 or 3 minutes to help us raise the volume and bring more attention to this issue. CLICK THIS LINK AND SHOW YOUR SUPPORT! https://oneclickpolitics.global.ssl.fastly.net/messages/edit?_kx=fZn-PyCnNEUH-3y6fhBxzbYNT_fvWqGyc17Prp3s310%3D.ThLeNS&promo_id=15300&utm_campaign=NAGR+-+NoTriggerBan.org+-+1+(VQ49RJ)&utm_medium=email&utm_source=Dealer+List Need to contact us? CustomerService@RareBreedTriggers.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dpete Posted May 20, 2022 Report Share Posted May 20, 2022 Rare Breed is taking Garland and the ATF to court. If you want to plow through a lot of legaleze here is the lawsuit. https://theinfidel.co/blogs/rare-breed-news/rare-breed-triggers-llc-v-garland-et-al-3-2022cv00085-atf-doj-new-lawsuit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blue109 Posted May 20, 2022 Report Share Posted May 20, 2022 Bad ass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted May 21, 2022 Author Report Share Posted May 21, 2022 Got a small writeup about this today from GAT Daily, and the link to the whole 60-page lawsuit. A few items of note: While we haven't read the entirety of the sixty plus pages, we did immediately catch a few things right out of the gates. We expect a lot of analysis coming from this, as the lawyers among us pick it apart, but here is what immediately caught our attention. The language used in addressing the ATF's due process violations, as well as a direct challenge to the ATF's lack of authority to make arbitrary rulings, makes it very clear that Rare Breed is still in this fight. They do not pull any punches here. Another quickly noticed item is the change of venue from FL to ND. This is pure speculation on our part, but we can see many business reasons for this decision. First and foremost, RBT is fighting on enough fronts already. Florida's law banning the sale of bump stocks reads in part 790.222 'the term "bump-fire stock” means a conversion kit, a tool, an accessory, or a device used to alter the rate of fire of a firearm to mimic automatic weapon fire or which is used to increase the rate of fire to a faster rate than is possible for a person to fire such semiautomatic firearm unassisted by a kit, a tool, an accessory, or a device.' While Rare Breed could fight the legality of the FRT under this law all day long, I'm sure, it's not a fight they need right now. A second VERY logical business reason to move to North Dakota is two fold: first, ND has much more friendly firearms laws, and is a Second Amendment Sanctuary State; and second, business taxes in ND are far less cumbersome than in Florida. As more documents are filed and become publicly available for us to download, we will keep posting them and updating you via email. Stay tuned! Start Reading Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ka0s Kontrol Posted August 26, 2022 Report Share Posted August 26, 2022 (edited) Wondering if anyone can post exact measurements of all the parts before "losing it in an unfortunate boating accident". >_> Seriously, though, if someone still has access to one of these, it would be great if they could break out some calipers and get precise measurements of everything (especially the outer shell/carrier)...preferably in millimeters, and post those measurements somewhere like Odysee or somewhere similar. If someone were to do that, certain people could create a 3D CAD model to share since it would then be covered under the 1st amendment. Though, if someone were to do it, I would suggest using a vpn and possibly proxy chaining. Can't stop the signal! Edited August 26, 2022 by Ka0s Kontrol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ka0s Kontrol Posted August 26, 2022 Report Share Posted August 26, 2022 (edited) As a side-note to my previous post, ATF trying to use chevron deference on the rarebreed case should be invalid since the definition of machine gun is quite clear in the NFA. "By a single action of the trigger" clearly means by a single movement. The FRT requires more than one movement of the trigger to fire more than one round. Each complete rearward movement fires a single round...not multiple rounds. Any person or entity that reads it differently is either suffering from a severely deficient intelligence, or has malicious/ill/evil intent. I'll see myself out now. Edited August 26, 2022 by Ka0s Kontrol Forgot to say Hi. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blue109 Posted August 26, 2022 Report Share Posted August 26, 2022 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted August 27, 2022 Author Report Share Posted August 27, 2022 Had to give mine back a long time ago, it was a "loaner" to try out. Loved it, though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blue109 Posted August 27, 2022 Report Share Posted August 27, 2022 (edited) Last time I brought mine out it ran a little choppy. Wondering if I screwed that spring up. Seemed like the weak link in the system. This looked kinda neat. https://militiastatearmory.com/product/frt-lock-bar-spring-kit/ Edited August 27, 2022 by blue109 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted February 2, 2023 Author Report Share Posted February 2, 2023 Here's a wild reference and update to this one. This one ends up going "solvent trap" but starts out talking about Rare Breed Triggers, the FRTs. This is a great video. BATFE over-reach. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikedaddyH Posted February 2, 2023 Report Share Posted February 2, 2023 I am hearing the ATF is now claiming the FRT trigger is very similar to a AR1 trigger from decades ago. Maybe they will try a patent infringement angle. If and when it gets to the SCOTUS i think the NFA may lose . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jtallen83 Posted February 2, 2023 Report Share Posted February 2, 2023 1 hour ago, MikedaddyH said: Maybe they will try a patent infringement angle. Pretty sure the owner of rare Breed is the owner of that patent, almost like the whole thing was a set-up to get a case against the NFA? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikedaddyH Posted February 2, 2023 Report Share Posted February 2, 2023 3 hours ago, jtallen83 said: Pretty sure the owner of rare Breed is the owner of that patent, almost like the whole thing was a set-up to get a case against the NFA? Thats pretty much what i got from his interview. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted February 3, 2023 Author Report Share Posted February 3, 2023 18 hours ago, MikedaddyH said: I am hearing the ATF is now claiming the FRT trigger is very similar to a AR1 trigger from decades ago. From decades ago - would mean that the previous patent has expired, and is no longer valid. People "patent Patents" all the time - pounce upon the original patent expiration date. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikedaddyH Posted February 3, 2023 Report Share Posted February 3, 2023 5 minutes ago, 98Z5V said: From decades ago - would mean that the previous patent has expired, and is no longer valid. People "patent Patents" all the time - pounce upon the original patent expiration date. A week ago they were trying to use mail fraud... 😂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blue109 Posted February 3, 2023 Report Share Posted February 3, 2023 https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=llIVHlduUmk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
98Z5V Posted February 25, 2023 Author Report Share Posted February 25, 2023 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unforgiven Posted February 25, 2023 Report Share Posted February 25, 2023 Having tried the trigger 3rd bursts were easy to accomplish. It's a shame the way this is going. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shooterrex Posted February 25, 2023 Report Share Posted February 25, 2023 This will be in court for years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikedaddyH Posted February 25, 2023 Report Share Posted February 25, 2023 CRS latest video compares himself to fox news... Ouch ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unforgiven Posted February 26, 2023 Report Share Posted February 26, 2023 If you can find one $400.00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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